Lawn Care Business Forum Lawn Care Business Book Lawn Care Business Blog Lawn Care Software
Home Forum Contract & Flyer Templates Blog Software Videos Podcast Calculators / Estimators Store Mower Review Design It Yourself Lawn Business School

Go Back   GopherHaul Landscaping & Lawn Care Business Marketing Forum > Business > General Business Discussions

General Business Discussions A place to talk about general business discussions.

Providing equipment with a friend


General Business Discussions

A place to talk about general business discussions.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 03-10-2009, 10:46 PM
frhsboy02 frhsboy02 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 6
frhsboy02 is on a distinguished road
Default Providing equipment with a friend

Hello, i just started a lawn care business this summer with a friend. We had our first mulching job this past Sat. We each got payed $100. However, for the business i am providing the Truck, trailer, walk behind, weed eater, blower tarp and storage. He is providing some shovels/rakes and a weed eater. How would you split the income? i thought about equally paying for the gass money and then i get 2/3 he gets 1/3? Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Reply With Quote

Stop guess-timating. Learn how to estimate and make money! $$$
Mow Time Estimator Lawn Care Price Estimator Mulch and Topsoil Calculator Snow Plow Estimate Calculator


  #2  
Old 03-10-2009, 10:51 PM
Steve's Avatar
Steve Steve is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 36,192
Rep Power: 10
Steve has disabled reputation
Default

Lawn care business tipsLawn Care Business Book
This is a great question and this is a reason why partnerships are all to often disasters.

Because you are right, how do you go about splitting that up? It is very difficult to sit down with a friend and say, look I own the truck I need to get paid more. I agree you do, but it never seems to work out right.

Here is my take and others can jump in as well.

Right now, its all an experiment.

Take money out to pay for gas and oil and whatever and then just split the income with him.

Is it fair to you? No, but in the long run you will benefit because you are learning how to do all this and then who knows, maybe one day in the near future, you will go off on your own and run your own business.

What's your take on that?
__________________
- Subscribe to my Lawn Care Marketing Blog Feed and get daily tips sent to you. Free!
Download your Free trial of Gopher Lawn Care Software.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-10-2009, 11:30 PM
SuperiorPower
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Steve has a good point. Depending how "good" of a friend your partner is, you may want to sit down with him and explain to him that you have a much bigger investment. If he is not open to the matter than maybe you need to split before you get too deep..... If he is open to suggestions ask him how he thinks you need to split it. You may also suggest something down this line:

Figure up what the total equipment investment is between the two of you, including the truck. Let's say you that hypothetically have invested 85% of the total equipment value and he has a 15% investment. Either pay yourselves a same wage, say $10 per hour, and then split the remainder up 85% to you and 15% to him. Or, split the entire thing up 85%/15%. Either of these may be an encouragement to your partner to start investing more himself and thus bring it close to 50/50. So if your job paid $200 and you split it 85/15 then you would get $170 and he would get $30. Yep, its a big difference but if that is the split in investment you deserve the same rate of return on your investment as he does. If it is only because he is unable to afford to make a greater contribution to the cause and you want to help him, that is up to you.

Maybe you need to each throw, lets say 5%, of each job into a pot for expenses such as gas and oil for the truck and mowers. I suppose this money could all come from the owner of the equipment but at that rate the owner of that equipment needs to get more than his percentage because his equipment has recurring expenses that a rake and a shovel will never have (gas, oil, tuneup, and etc).

Something that you need to remember, which is just general business, if your job paid $200 you need to set some of that aside for equipment repair or replacement. Long ago a friend of ours told my dad that if you own a business it is always either growing or dying. It is never at a stand still. Thus you need to always be investing money into it. This does not mean you have to spend money every day, every week, or even every month. But it does mean that some of your profits need to be used to grow even if you are saving it for that bigger trailer, bigger mower, 2nd mower, new trimmer, equipment to start a 2nd crew, or whatever.

Hopefully your friend will be understanding and be willing to allow you the same rate of return on investment. If not, perhaps you need to seperate ways while you are still on speaking terms. Then you can still go fishing together...

Sorry for the long narration but I hope it helps.....

Eli

Last edited by SuperiorPower; 03-10-2009 at 11:35 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-10-2009, 11:57 PM
Little's's Avatar
Little's Little's is offline
Brandon
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Shasta Lake CA.
Posts: 814
Rep Power: 8
Little's is on a distinguished road
Default

Great reply Eli. Very insightful.
__________________
Northern California
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-11-2009, 01:13 AM
swstout's Avatar
swstout swstout is offline
Steve
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Canastota, NY
Age: 65
Posts: 1,082
Rep Power: 7
swstout is on a distinguished road
Default Doesn't (work)

I have been in 2 partnerships in my life and both ended in disaster. The first one with unequal investment and the second with equal investments.

Returning from my 3rd tour in Viet Nam, 8 of us had the opportunity to by a beer and wine bar in Jacksonville Florida. We each put in $1,500.00. Everyone equal so there would be no problems. Wrong!!

After the novelty of ownership wore off, only 3 of the eight put in any time (work), but everyone wanted an equal share!

At the start, we all agreed to take specific shifts. If because of duty conflicts (we all were still GI's), or any other reason the schedule couldn't be kept it was up to the problem owner to pay someone to take his shift. Only 3 of us kept the place open Monday - Saturday 10A -2+P.

Equal investment is fine only when equal responsibility it present. With partnerships this is never the case.

Don't take on a partner! Take on an employee!

Steve
Reply With Quote
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-11-2009, 06:30 PM
musician/lawnman's Avatar
musician/lawnman musician/lawnman is offline
Chuck
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: South West Florida
Posts: 919
Rep Power: 7
musician/lawnman is on a distinguished road
Thumbs down

I'm with Steve here man. Go it alone. I had considered taking on a partner in the beggining. It's a bad idea especialy with friends or family. You will in the end, end up either out of business or one buys the other out & you will not be on speaking terms when all is said & done. Buy a couple rakes & shovels now, & avoid the aggrivation & expense later. 2 People are never going to work "just as hard" as each other, it's never a 50/50 split on moneyinvested, time, effort, drive etc. This will be especially so if he doesn't have much invested. Above the mentioned figuring out what the percentage of investment is.... If you are just hell-bent on trying to make it work, I would figure it out & if it is say a 85% to 15% split worth say a total of $10,000 (using round numbers to make it easy) Then you have $8500 in & he has $1500 right? If he wants to be a 50/50 partner & get serious about business then he needs to ante up to a 50/50 investment. In this example he needs to give you $3500 to bring you two to an equal $5000 dollar investment. He needs to "buy in" to the company as a partner, right now he should be viewed as help.

There will be problems later though too. There will be times when you see that you need to advertise to continue to grow. Maybe the ad you want to run costs $200 a month. But he's not as good with money so he's personally broke & doesn't want to give up his half of that expense. So now you either A) don't run it & don't grow. Or B) you pay the whole expense yourself.
If you choose (A) your stagnant & he's holding you back. If you choose (B) & gain 5 new clients from that ad at say $100/month each
(a total of $500/month) Does he get an equal $250 of that? You wouldn't have that business if not for you right? He didn't put in so what do you do now? If you cut him out he'll be pissed! IF you pay him equally then he just learned that he no longer needs to put in the money,effort, time, etc. because your going to do it all anyway & he can just sit back & collect.
Not really a partnership now is it? Drop him him off now now before you get off the ground, cause by then your choices are drop him from way up there & watch him fall, or crash & burn with him.
__________________
AAA QUALITY CLEAN CUT, LLC.
LAWN CARE & LANDSCAPING
Visit us here:

  #7  
Old 03-11-2009, 09:14 PM
SuperiorPower
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by musician/lawnman View Post
There will be times when you see that you need to advertise to continue to grow. Maybe the ad you want to run costs $200 a month. But he's not as good with money so he's personally broke & doesn't want to give up his half of that expense. So now you either A) don't run it & don't grow. Or B) you pay the whole expense yourself.
If you choose (A) your stagnant & he's holding you back. If you choose (B) & gain 5 new clients from that ad at say $100/month each
(a total of $500/month) Does he get an equal $250 of that? You wouldn't have that business if not for you right? He didn't put in so what do you do now? If you cut him out he'll be pissed! IF you pay him equally then he just learned that he no longer needs to put in the money,effort, time, etc. because your going to do it all anyway & he can just sit back & collect.

Ahhh, very good example of what could happen. Like I said originally, both "partners" deserve the same rate of return on their investment. Invest little, reap little.

I have been told that anythign with 2 heads is a freak and is dead already. You and I both know that if you are partners you will disagree and both of you think the other should see it your way. That is what I mean by having 2 heads.

I agree with everyone else, go it alone. You may upset him now but he won't be as upset as he would be later when you cut him out of the profits that he did not help earn.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-11-2009, 11:02 PM
Steve's Avatar
Steve Steve is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 36,192
Rep Power: 10
Steve has disabled reputation
Default

This post brings up many good points.

It is fascinating how often we as people when just getting started in the business world, don't want to go out on our own. We figure if we can get a friend to go along with us, that is great, as long as we aren't doing it alone.

It's like a reaffirmation. If my friend feels we can do it, then maybe we can do it!

So I think that is why many new businesses get started like that, especially when you are in your teens.
__________________
- Subscribe to my Lawn Care Marketing Blog Feed and get daily tips sent to you. Free!
Download your Free trial of Gopher Lawn Care Software.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-12-2009, 04:09 AM
picframer's Avatar
picframer picframer is offline
Andy
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia
Posts: 2,885
Rep Power: 9
picframer will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
This post brings up many good points.

It is fascinating how often we as people when just getting started in the business world, don't want to go out on our own. We figure if we can get a friend to go along with us, that is great, as long as we aren't doing it alone.

It's like a reaffirmation. If my friend feels we can do it, then maybe we can do it!

So I think that is why many new businesses get started like that, especially when you are in your teens.
I thought about this thread yesterday driving back from an auction, I am a go it alone person, I think due to 18 years of banking and seeing issues with just about every partnership that came across my desk, only one person can drive the ship, doesn't mean you can't have a great first mate to help you.

I was taking the garbage out a week or so ago, a neighbour was out walking his dog, he stopped and we talked, he loves tractors and wanted to see the new unit, Jack is a super guy but when it comes to machinery he just doesn't have what it takes however he has the best looking property in our subdivision. He asked who would be doing our landscape design as he is retiring next year and has been thinking of offering this service and starting a business, I explained we would contract this out until we are big enough, he suggested we partner, I said yes however you start your own company and we will sub to you or if you are doing a job sub to us. He would have rather joined our company however I know that motivation comes when you have to push yourself to bring in the business and I do not want/need a partner other than my son as we have workied together since he was 12 and it always worked great.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-12-2009, 07:25 PM
frhsboy02 frhsboy02 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 6
frhsboy02 is on a distinguished road
Default Great help

Thank you for all the reply's. I am very surprised with the number of interest in this post. Every reply has some very valueable information. I think i am going to take the advise and try to go solo. It seems that everybody that has some business experience knows that you are digging yourself in a hole if you try to make it a partnership.

The only thing is that im in highschool and play football and basketball. I am pretty busy in the summer, but for the most part i think i can do it myself. I plan on getting 10 to 15 houses. If that means i have to work on Sat + Sun i will do that. However, i do have 2 adays for football and have team camps for basketball which will be very tireing and it would be stressful to balance both. I have an older brother who said he would help me when ever i needed it and i also have a brother-in-law who also said he would help, also. Besides who doesnt need some extra money with the economy the way it is? I dont want to get in over my head, but i do think i have the resources to do it.

I think i will print off some flyers with my name and number and if i need some help, i think it would be very easy to find someone. However, the hard part is, how do i tell my friend i dont need him anymore? We already had 3 of his neighbors lined up and already had a mulch job in his neighborhood. I would feel bad leaving him because this would be his summer job, but i think it would be for the better.

Any help would be appreciated, Thanks for all the help, Pat
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
partnership, providing

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
trying to help a friend who is a lawn guy pblake61 Introduce Yourself 1 08-19-2008 09:50 PM
is it ok to just get help from a friend and pay per job? Lukacs Property Maintenance General Talk 7 07-15-2008 01:06 AM
Your New friend anadyf Introduce Yourself 5 10-13-2007 01:25 PM
Jeff Cumbie gets media attention by providing Steve Lawn Care Marketing & Post your marketing material for review! 1 06-11-2007 12:33 AM
Refer a Friend Program tiedeman General Business Discussions 3 04-04-2006 12:57 PM

» Recent Threads
  RatingTitle, Username, & Date Last Post Replies Views
Texas lawn care company...
Livingston Lawn Care
Yesterday 11:29 AM
Today 07:34 AM
by Livingston Lawn Care
4 73
These are the days on...
ExtremeLawncareServices
03-22-2014 09:12 AM
Today 12:20 AM
by ExtremeLawncareServices
78 4,441
Left handed edging with...
SGL1
07-23-2014 08:59 PM
Yesterday 10:56 PM
by SGL1
10 182
new trailer help
mattthelawnguy
07-11-2014 08:21 PM
Yesterday 06:31 PM
by mattthelawnguy
13 436
Echo Edger 'Neutral'
WesleySnips
Yesterday 05:28 PM
Yesterday 05:58 PM
by Just for Cuts
1 47
Single tree, mow customer
WesleySnips
06-27-2014 10:12 AM
Yesterday 05:43 PM
by WesleySnips
13 556
New from Texas
Livingston Lawn Care
Yesterday 11:17 AM
Yesterday 01:47 PM
by Steve
1 62
You know it;s gonna be a...
stevef1201
Yesterday 08:50 AM
Yesterday 01:34 PM
by Steve
1 65
Customer letters
kslawn
07-23-2014 06:17 AM
Yesterday 01:20 PM
by Steve
5 154
Got my first lawn job...
SGL1
06-11-2014 09:19 PM
07-24-2014 07:09 PM
by SGL1
29 1,213
Need help determining...
Jbss861
07-20-2014 02:33 PM
07-24-2014 01:11 PM
by Steve
13 342
Should I ?
googus
07-22-2014 04:06 PM
07-24-2014 12:10 PM
by Steve
4 182
My First Apartment...
SSLCtn
05-26-2014 10:17 PM
07-24-2014 06:46 AM
by kslawn
15 882
Crop Rotation Techniques...
eastsidelandcare
07-17-2014 03:47 PM
07-24-2014 06:38 AM
by kslawn
3 193
Selling lawns like...
eastsidelandcare
07-17-2014 03:51 PM
07-24-2014 06:28 AM
by kslawn
3 238
Scag new "Eliminator"......
ExtremeLawncareServices
07-20-2014 10:45 AM
07-23-2014 05:37 PM
by Just for Cuts
9 268
need professional advice...
Fiddlers_green
07-20-2014 07:21 PM
07-23-2014 12:42 PM
by Steve
3 176
new to me box truck
jrayb39667
03-06-2014 10:20 PM
07-23-2014 12:40 PM
by Steve
15 1,368
Lawn Service back in...
LawnCareMan280
07-18-2014 09:00 PM
07-23-2014 11:48 AM
by Steve
4 217
Overspray?
stevef1201
07-21-2014 04:20 PM
07-23-2014 11:39 AM
by Steve
3 121
Hello Everyone! Newbie...
SLKlawn
07-17-2014 06:22 PM
07-22-2014 01:53 PM
by Steve
6 258
Proper height for lawn
rob lederhilger
05-26-2014 08:01 AM
07-21-2014 02:53 PM
by LawnDoctor
9 648
Blade sharpener
Just for Cuts
07-04-2014 12:31 PM
07-21-2014 01:48 PM
by Steve
9 486
What's my business worth?
Chaz
07-16-2014 01:35 PM
07-21-2014 01:45 PM
by Steve
4 269
1.5 Acre Jungle
WesleySnips
07-15-2014 05:57 PM
07-20-2014 11:31 AM
by ExtremeLawncareServices
21 577
Gopher schedule software
Ray
07-18-2014 04:13 PM
07-18-2014 04:13 PM
by Ray
0 155
2006 Chevy fuel pump...
KevinsLawns
07-17-2014 08:39 PM
07-18-2014 11:51 AM
by Steve
1 160
Halfway point of year!
Steve
07-01-2014 12:08 PM
07-18-2014 11:38 AM
by Steve
14 709
I got told to leave and...
gwilson98
06-16-2014 02:07 PM
07-17-2014 11:43 AM
by Steve
16 1,023
Hey guys this is the...
prmenter@gmail.com
07-07-2014 08:23 PM
07-16-2014 08:10 PM
by ExtremeLawncareServices
28 747
Mowing the hills
prmenter@gmail.com
07-08-2014 12:22 PM
07-16-2014 05:00 PM
by Just for Cuts
18 685
Say Hello !!!
Steve
03-19-2007 11:18 AM
07-15-2014 05:38 PM
by icon2000
1,184 319,164
need some help geting...
dalvan0
07-13-2014 09:28 PM
07-15-2014 11:56 AM
by Steve
5 256
Classified Ad Template...
bcfb
06-05-2013 02:40 AM
07-15-2014 11:16 AM
by Steve
15 3,697
Husqvarna pz 60
CDLAWNCARE
07-06-2014 06:50 PM
07-15-2014 08:53 AM
by kslawn
10 439
Lowballers
Chaz
07-11-2014 03:55 PM
07-14-2014 12:27 PM
by Steve
5 360
My new side job
Sprinkler Buddy
05-10-2014 05:23 AM
07-14-2014 12:15 PM
by Steve
10 820
Illegal spraying
GoGreenerKS
07-04-2014 09:11 AM
07-13-2014 10:36 PM
by GoGreenerKS
10 550
New Mower and Trailer
Chaz
06-25-2014 12:04 PM
07-13-2014 06:25 PM
by SGL1
7 556
What Fertilizer to Use?
acrajchel
04-07-2014 01:56 PM
07-12-2014 07:36 PM
by SGL1
21 1,874
Fuel and fuel additives
SGL1
07-06-2014 10:23 AM
07-11-2014 07:53 PM
by SGL1
15 538
Questions for a patchy...
jumcgee
07-09-2014 08:42 AM
07-11-2014 12:34 PM
by Steve
1 209
toro proline blades wont...
boog
06-25-2014 06:26 PM
07-11-2014 05:28 AM
by kslawn
18 642
Contents of Marketing to...
prmenter@gmail.com
07-09-2014 05:25 PM
07-10-2014 03:23 PM
by Steve
3 303
Shindaiwa
CLB454
05-13-2014 09:04 PM
07-10-2014 03:04 PM
by Steve
14 785
Starting New in FL
mmcuttrim
08-06-2010 09:22 AM
07-10-2014 02:44 PM
by Steve
48 11,271
Bid help 45 on acre...
Priggan
06-26-2014 12:56 PM
07-09-2014 08:38 AM
by kslawn
7 520
need help bidding fence...
veteranslawncaresystems
07-03-2014 10:33 AM
07-08-2014 12:00 PM
by Steve
5 384
Trimmer or Knife?
gwilson98
07-04-2014 09:56 PM
07-07-2014 02:41 PM
by Steve
6 346
Started a New Solar Lawn...
Solar Lawn Care
06-08-2013 01:40 AM
07-07-2014 01:55 PM
by Steve
37 7,422
» Popular Tags
advertisement article marketing bid charge christmas lighting christmas light service courtesy call credit card processing customers decorating ecosymbiosis escrow estimate exmark ferris four wheel drive fundraiser gopherhaul grass gravely gravely 34" zero turn hills holiday holiday decorating holiday lighting honda how much to charge introduction kawasaki lawn lawn care business lawn care business book lawn care business seo lawn care business show lawn care business website lawn care business website seo lawn care website leaf removal managing a lawn care business marketing native plants new buisness new mower office management online classifieds outdoor environments podcast push versus ride redmax reo rotating scag scripts search engine optimization season seo snow sprayer starting a business starting a lawn care business steve stihl subcontractor theft toro tractor auger turfgrass consulting walker wright stander rh zero turn
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.1.0

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:50 AM.


(C) 2011 Riggs Publications - Terms of use & Privacy Policy

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:50 AM.

(C) 2011 Riggs Publications - Terms of use & Privacy Policy