Lawn Care Business Forum Lawn Care Business Book Lawn Care Business Blog Lawn Care Software
Home Forum Contract & Flyer Templates Blog Software Videos Podcast Calculators / Estimators Store Mower Review Design It Yourself Lawn Business School

Go Back   GopherHaul Landscaping & Lawn Care Business Marketing Forum > Business > General Business Discussions

General Business Discussions A place to talk about general business discussions.

Providing equipment with a friend


General Business Discussions

A place to talk about general business discussions.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 03-10-2009, 10:46 PM
frhsboy02 frhsboy02 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 8
frhsboy02 is on a distinguished road
Default Providing equipment with a friend

Hello, i just started a lawn care business this summer with a friend. We had our first mulching job this past Sat. We each got payed $100. However, for the business i am providing the Truck, trailer, walk behind, weed eater, blower tarp and storage. He is providing some shovels/rakes and a weed eater. How would you split the income? i thought about equally paying for the gass money and then i get 2/3 he gets 1/3? Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Reply With Quote

Stop guess-timating. Learn how to estimate and make money! $$$
Mow Time Estimator Lawn Care Price Estimator Mulch and Topsoil Calculator Snow Plow Estimate Calculator


  #2  
Old 03-10-2009, 10:51 PM
Steve's Avatar
Steve Steve is online now
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 38,037
Rep Power: 10
Steve has disabled reputation
Default

Lawn care business tipsLawn Care Business Book
This is a great question and this is a reason why partnerships are all to often disasters.

Because you are right, how do you go about splitting that up? It is very difficult to sit down with a friend and say, look I own the truck I need to get paid more. I agree you do, but it never seems to work out right.

Here is my take and others can jump in as well.

Right now, its all an experiment.

Take money out to pay for gas and oil and whatever and then just split the income with him.

Is it fair to you? No, but in the long run you will benefit because you are learning how to do all this and then who knows, maybe one day in the near future, you will go off on your own and run your own business.

What's your take on that?
__________________
- Subscribe to my Lawn Care Marketing Blog Feed and get daily tips sent to you. Free!
Download your Free trial of Gopher Lawn Care Software.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-10-2009, 11:30 PM
SuperiorPower
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Steve has a good point. Depending how "good" of a friend your partner is, you may want to sit down with him and explain to him that you have a much bigger investment. If he is not open to the matter than maybe you need to split before you get too deep..... If he is open to suggestions ask him how he thinks you need to split it. You may also suggest something down this line:

Figure up what the total equipment investment is between the two of you, including the truck. Let's say you that hypothetically have invested 85% of the total equipment value and he has a 15% investment. Either pay yourselves a same wage, say $10 per hour, and then split the remainder up 85% to you and 15% to him. Or, split the entire thing up 85%/15%. Either of these may be an encouragement to your partner to start investing more himself and thus bring it close to 50/50. So if your job paid $200 and you split it 85/15 then you would get $170 and he would get $30. Yep, its a big difference but if that is the split in investment you deserve the same rate of return on your investment as he does. If it is only because he is unable to afford to make a greater contribution to the cause and you want to help him, that is up to you.

Maybe you need to each throw, lets say 5%, of each job into a pot for expenses such as gas and oil for the truck and mowers. I suppose this money could all come from the owner of the equipment but at that rate the owner of that equipment needs to get more than his percentage because his equipment has recurring expenses that a rake and a shovel will never have (gas, oil, tuneup, and etc).

Something that you need to remember, which is just general business, if your job paid $200 you need to set some of that aside for equipment repair or replacement. Long ago a friend of ours told my dad that if you own a business it is always either growing or dying. It is never at a stand still. Thus you need to always be investing money into it. This does not mean you have to spend money every day, every week, or even every month. But it does mean that some of your profits need to be used to grow even if you are saving it for that bigger trailer, bigger mower, 2nd mower, new trimmer, equipment to start a 2nd crew, or whatever.

Hopefully your friend will be understanding and be willing to allow you the same rate of return on investment. If not, perhaps you need to seperate ways while you are still on speaking terms. Then you can still go fishing together...

Sorry for the long narration but I hope it helps.....

Eli

Last edited by SuperiorPower; 03-10-2009 at 11:35 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-10-2009, 11:57 PM
Little's's Avatar
Little's Little's is offline
Brandon
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Shasta Lake CA.
Posts: 814
Rep Power: 10
Little's is on a distinguished road
Default

Great reply Eli. Very insightful.
__________________
Northern California
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-11-2009, 01:13 AM
swstout's Avatar
swstout swstout is offline
Steve
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Canastota, NY
Age: 67
Posts: 1,082
Rep Power: 9
swstout is on a distinguished road
Default Doesn't (work)

I have been in 2 partnerships in my life and both ended in disaster. The first one with unequal investment and the second with equal investments.

Returning from my 3rd tour in Viet Nam, 8 of us had the opportunity to by a beer and wine bar in Jacksonville Florida. We each put in $1,500.00. Everyone equal so there would be no problems. Wrong!!

After the novelty of ownership wore off, only 3 of the eight put in any time (work), but everyone wanted an equal share!

At the start, we all agreed to take specific shifts. If because of duty conflicts (we all were still GI's), or any other reason the schedule couldn't be kept it was up to the problem owner to pay someone to take his shift. Only 3 of us kept the place open Monday - Saturday 10A -2+P.

Equal investment is fine only when equal responsibility it present. With partnerships this is never the case.

Don't take on a partner! Take on an employee!

Steve
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-11-2009, 06:30 PM
musician/lawnman musician/lawnman is offline
Chuck
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: South West Florida
Posts: 919
Rep Power: 0
musician/lawnman is on a distinguished road
Thumbs down

I'm with Steve here man. Go it alone. I had considered taking on a partner in the beggining. It's a bad idea especialy with friends or family. You will in the end, end up either out of business or one buys the other out & you will not be on speaking terms when all is said & done. Buy a couple rakes & shovels now, & avoid the aggrivation & expense later. 2 People are never going to work "just as hard" as each other, it's never a 50/50 split on moneyinvested, time, effort, drive etc. This will be especially so if he doesn't have much invested. Above the mentioned figuring out what the percentage of investment is.... If you are just hell-bent on trying to make it work, I would figure it out & if it is say a 85% to 15% split worth say a total of $10,000 (using round numbers to make it easy) Then you have $8500 in & he has $1500 right? If he wants to be a 50/50 partner & get serious about business then he needs to ante up to a 50/50 investment. In this example he needs to give you $3500 to bring you two to an equal $5000 dollar investment. He needs to "buy in" to the company as a partner, right now he should be viewed as help.

There will be problems later though too. There will be times when you see that you need to advertise to continue to grow. Maybe the ad you want to run costs $200 a month. But he's not as good with money so he's personally broke & doesn't want to give up his half of that expense. So now you either A) don't run it & don't grow. Or B) you pay the whole expense yourself.
If you choose (A) your stagnant & he's holding you back. If you choose (B) & gain 5 new clients from that ad at say $100/month each
(a total of $500/month) Does he get an equal $250 of that? You wouldn't have that business if not for you right? He didn't put in so what do you do now? If you cut him out he'll be pissed! IF you pay him equally then he just learned that he no longer needs to put in the money,effort, time, etc. because your going to do it all anyway & he can just sit back & collect.
Not really a partnership now is it? Drop him him off now now before you get off the ground, cause by then your choices are drop him from way up there & watch him fall, or crash & burn with him.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-11-2009, 09:14 PM
SuperiorPower
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by musician/lawnman View Post
There will be times when you see that you need to advertise to continue to grow. Maybe the ad you want to run costs $200 a month. But he's not as good with money so he's personally broke & doesn't want to give up his half of that expense. So now you either A) don't run it & don't grow. Or B) you pay the whole expense yourself.
If you choose (A) your stagnant & he's holding you back. If you choose (B) & gain 5 new clients from that ad at say $100/month each
(a total of $500/month) Does he get an equal $250 of that? You wouldn't have that business if not for you right? He didn't put in so what do you do now? If you cut him out he'll be pissed! IF you pay him equally then he just learned that he no longer needs to put in the money,effort, time, etc. because your going to do it all anyway & he can just sit back & collect.

Ahhh, very good example of what could happen. Like I said originally, both "partners" deserve the same rate of return on their investment. Invest little, reap little.

I have been told that anythign with 2 heads is a freak and is dead already. You and I both know that if you are partners you will disagree and both of you think the other should see it your way. That is what I mean by having 2 heads.

I agree with everyone else, go it alone. You may upset him now but he won't be as upset as he would be later when you cut him out of the profits that he did not help earn.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-11-2009, 11:02 PM
Steve's Avatar
Steve Steve is online now
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 38,037
Rep Power: 10
Steve has disabled reputation
Default

This post brings up many good points.

It is fascinating how often we as people when just getting started in the business world, don't want to go out on our own. We figure if we can get a friend to go along with us, that is great, as long as we aren't doing it alone.

It's like a reaffirmation. If my friend feels we can do it, then maybe we can do it!

So I think that is why many new businesses get started like that, especially when you are in your teens.
__________________
- Subscribe to my Lawn Care Marketing Blog Feed and get daily tips sent to you. Free!
Download your Free trial of Gopher Lawn Care Software.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-12-2009, 04:09 AM
picframer's Avatar
picframer picframer is offline
Andy
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia
Posts: 2,885
Rep Power: 11
picframer will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
This post brings up many good points.

It is fascinating how often we as people when just getting started in the business world, don't want to go out on our own. We figure if we can get a friend to go along with us, that is great, as long as we aren't doing it alone.

It's like a reaffirmation. If my friend feels we can do it, then maybe we can do it!

So I think that is why many new businesses get started like that, especially when you are in your teens.
I thought about this thread yesterday driving back from an auction, I am a go it alone person, I think due to 18 years of banking and seeing issues with just about every partnership that came across my desk, only one person can drive the ship, doesn't mean you can't have a great first mate to help you.

I was taking the garbage out a week or so ago, a neighbour was out walking his dog, he stopped and we talked, he loves tractors and wanted to see the new unit, Jack is a super guy but when it comes to machinery he just doesn't have what it takes however he has the best looking property in our subdivision. He asked who would be doing our landscape design as he is retiring next year and has been thinking of offering this service and starting a business, I explained we would contract this out until we are big enough, he suggested we partner, I said yes however you start your own company and we will sub to you or if you are doing a job sub to us. He would have rather joined our company however I know that motivation comes when you have to push yourself to bring in the business and I do not want/need a partner other than my son as we have workied together since he was 12 and it always worked great.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-12-2009, 07:25 PM
frhsboy02 frhsboy02 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 8
frhsboy02 is on a distinguished road
Default Great help

Thank you for all the reply's. I am very surprised with the number of interest in this post. Every reply has some very valueable information. I think i am going to take the advise and try to go solo. It seems that everybody that has some business experience knows that you are digging yourself in a hole if you try to make it a partnership.

The only thing is that im in highschool and play football and basketball. I am pretty busy in the summer, but for the most part i think i can do it myself. I plan on getting 10 to 15 houses. If that means i have to work on Sat + Sun i will do that. However, i do have 2 adays for football and have team camps for basketball which will be very tireing and it would be stressful to balance both. I have an older brother who said he would help me when ever i needed it and i also have a brother-in-law who also said he would help, also. Besides who doesnt need some extra money with the economy the way it is? I dont want to get in over my head, but i do think i have the resources to do it.

I think i will print off some flyers with my name and number and if i need some help, i think it would be very easy to find someone. However, the hard part is, how do i tell my friend i dont need him anymore? We already had 3 of his neighbors lined up and already had a mulch job in his neighborhood. I would feel bad leaving him because this would be his summer job, but i think it would be for the better.

Any help would be appreciated, Thanks for all the help, Pat
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
partnership, providing

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
trying to help a friend who is a lawn guy pblake61 Introduce Yourself 1 08-19-2008 09:50 PM
is it ok to just get help from a friend and pay per job? Lukacs Property Maintenance General Talk 7 07-15-2008 01:06 AM
Your New friend anadyf Introduce Yourself 5 10-13-2007 01:25 PM
Jeff Cumbie gets media attention by providing Steve Lawn Care Marketing & Post your marketing material for review! 1 06-11-2007 12:33 AM
Refer a Friend Program tiedeman General Business Discussions 3 04-04-2006 12:57 PM

» Recent Threads
  RatingTitle, Username, & Date Last Post Replies Views
Landscaper taking on odd...
WarriorLandscapingCAN
08-07-2016 06:57 PM
Today 10:27 AM
by Steve
6 328
fliers
joshp
08-19-2016 03:23 PM
Today 10:24 AM
by Steve
4 97
Breaking into commercial...
SGL1
08-19-2016 07:02 AM
Today 10:12 AM
by mowandblow1980
7 126
Start My Own Business?
mowandblow1980
01-12-2016 07:43 PM
Yesterday 02:23 PM
by Andy S.
16 2,041
Snow Plow
acrajchel
08-17-2016 10:21 AM
08-22-2016 11:21 AM
by Steve
5 120
Quarter Acre Woodland...
ew411
08-16-2016 06:50 AM
08-18-2016 12:25 PM
by Steve
4 113
Bidding Bushhogging
acrajchel
08-15-2016 11:52 AM
08-17-2016 05:32 PM
by acrajchel
4 114
Hello From the Florida...
KevinShuman
08-15-2016 08:57 PM
08-16-2016 01:52 PM
by SC93
2 103
I'm making stupid money...
WarriorLandscapingCAN
08-07-2016 07:07 PM
08-16-2016 12:42 AM
by SC93
5 390
A quick Intro
BLE
08-14-2016 05:17 PM
08-15-2016 10:54 AM
by acrajchel
2 106
New Customer - Gettting...
acrajchel
08-05-2016 05:00 PM
08-15-2016 10:52 AM
by acrajchel
4 369
helping out a friend set...
Doug D
08-13-2016 11:33 AM
08-15-2016 09:45 AM
by Steve
1 122
Small bed job
Bradcook21
08-09-2016 09:52 PM
08-10-2016 03:51 PM
by Steve
1 235
Hello from NoVa
jtwlawn
08-03-2016 11:20 AM
08-09-2016 10:45 AM
by jtwlawn
4 365
How much to charge for...
jymie
03-31-2013 05:59 PM
08-08-2016 04:33 PM
by Steve
27 6,577
Needing a website built
burtle
06-17-2015 09:02 AM
08-07-2016 10:21 AM
by Just for Cuts
18 19,705
Review of our lawn care...
Lawnline
07-12-2016 06:40 PM
08-07-2016 08:44 AM
by Lawnline
5 1,750
New Site Hows it look
Infinitelawn
03-16-2015 10:32 AM
08-07-2016 08:37 AM
by Lawnline
8 11,205
Hey guys! Greetings from...
thegardener
08-05-2016 05:45 AM
08-05-2016 03:26 PM
by Steve
1 287
First Time Bidding-Need...
capitallawncrew
08-01-2016 08:30 AM
08-03-2016 09:52 AM
by Steve
3 407
Show us your stripes
Just for Cuts
05-21-2015 03:07 PM
08-01-2016 08:28 PM
by ExclusiveLawns
7 3,748
String trim BEFORE mow...
Mr. Mow
04-12-2015 08:13 AM
07-31-2016 10:36 AM
by joshp
13 5,893
Now Hiring Just South of...
Chilehead
07-27-2016 11:38 AM
07-27-2016 11:38 AM
by Chilehead
0 366
Hi from Long Island NY
Lori22
07-18-2016 02:01 PM
07-26-2016 11:22 PM
by Chilehead
11 668
Hi everyone!
greenwavemedia
07-25-2016 03:22 PM
07-26-2016 11:21 AM
by Lawnline
2 381
Hi! I'm Tony from Tampa
Lawnline
07-12-2016 06:47 PM
07-26-2016 11:12 AM
by Lawnline
6 991
Z246 Deck change question
JohnsLawnCare
07-25-2016 01:47 PM
07-25-2016 06:38 PM
by Steve
1 358
DIY Sprayer
acrajchel
07-25-2016 09:13 AM
07-25-2016 06:36 PM
by Steve
1 354
Hello Everyone
JohnsLawnCare
06-22-2016 11:14 AM
07-25-2016 06:20 PM
by Steve
15 931
Looking for new host
Just for Cuts
11-26-2015 06:58 AM
07-25-2016 02:49 PM
by greenwavemedia
9 1,846
» Popular Tags
apartment become an entrepreneur best mower be your own boss bidding break business business education business help business management complex contractor hacks contracts deck lift dethatcher edging entrepreneur entrepreneur education estimate estimates fuel problems fuel pump half moon blade intro introduction jjandm lawncare l.t.rich landscape landscape design landscaping landscaping design company landscaping richmond va landscping lawn lawncare lawnservice lowering grade marketing mulch planting raising grade residential lawn care richmond va richmond virginia lawn care safety scag snowblower snow plowing snow shovel sprayer start a business start a lawn care business start business start up toro timecutter townhome tree tree service video web design websites what to charge work from home z-max z-spray
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.1.0

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:29 AM.


(C) 2011 Riggs Publications - Terms of use & Privacy Policy

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:29 AM.

(C) 2011 Riggs Publications - Terms of use & Privacy Policy