Lawn Care Business Forum Lawn Care Business Book Lawn Care Business Blog Lawn Care Software
Home Forum Contract & Flyer Templates Blog Software Videos Podcast Calculators / Estimators Store Mower Review Design It Yourself Lawn Business School

Go Back   GopherHaul Landscaping & Lawn Care Business Marketing Forum > Business > General Business Discussions

General Business Discussions A place to talk about general business discussions.

Hiring


General Business Discussions

A place to talk about general business discussions.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 10-24-2007, 05:43 PM
JMM0254
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I would like to hire a person to help in snow plowing this year. I have a truck and plow for this person to use. I would like to pay this person cash(1099) as an independent sub-contractor. I have been told that this is impossible to do as because I will supply the equipment, the person can not be categorized as an independent sub-contractor. That the definition of a sub-contractor is one who uses only their own tools. I could ask that he brings his own snow shovel......

Anyone have any experience with this and can offer any suggestions?

I realize I would have to have this person added to the truck insurance, I can only assume this would not be a problem. He has a clear driving record and 4 years experience in snow plowing.

I would supply the plow truck, no benefits, gas, etc., have him sign a contract stating he would be covered while driving the truck in case of an accident, but any injuries, etc. would not put the company in any jeopardy.

I really could use some help here. Thanks.
Reply With Quote

Stop guess-timating. Learn how to estimate and make money! $$$
Mow Time Estimator Lawn Care Price Estimator Mulch and Topsoil Calculator Snow Plow Estimate Calculator


  #2  
Old 10-24-2007, 06:09 PM
Steve's Avatar
Steve Steve is online now
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 37,361
Rep Power: 10
Steve has disabled reputation
Default

Lawn care business tipsLawn Care Business Book
It's interesting you should ask this. Just the other day I was talking with a lawn care operator who was doing something similar and paying some staff members with a 1099 form.

A problem arose with one of the employees and now the lco has to go back and pay back taxes over the couple of years he was doing this as well as penalties.

To help you avoid such an unpleasant situation I found this information online and it might help you.

These are great questions to consider. When you review them, let me know of what your reflection is on all this.

Following are the 20-points that have been established:

1. Must the individual take instructions from your management staff regarding when, where, and how work is to be done?
2. Does the individual receive training from your company?
3. Is the success or continuation of your business somewhat dependent on the type of service provided by the individual?
4. Must the individual personally perform the contracted services?
5. Have you hired, supervised, or paid individuals to assist the worker in completing the project stated in the contract?
6. Is there a continuing relationship between your company and the individual?
7. Must the individual work set hours?
8. Is the individual required to work full time at your company?
9. Is the work performed on company premises?
10. Is the individual required to follow a set sequence or routine in the performance of his work?
11. Must the individual give you reports regarding his/her work?
12. Is the individual paid by the hour, week, or month?
13. Do you reimburse the individual for business/travel expenses?
14. Do you supply the individual with needed tools or materials?
15. Have you made a significant investment in facilities used by the individual to perform services?
16. Is the individual free from suffering a loss or realizing a profit based on his work?
17. Does the individual only perform services for your company?
18. Does the individual limit the availability of his services to the general public?
19. Do you have the right to discharge the individual?
20. May the individual terminate his services at any time?

In general "no" answers to questions 1-16 and "yes" answers to questions 17-20 indicate an independent contractor. However, a simple majority of "no" answers to questions 1 to 16 and "yes" answers to questions 17 to 20 does not guarantee independent contractor treatment. Some questions are either irrelevant or of less importance because the answers may apply equally to employees and independent contractors.

From here
http://www.topechelon.com/employers/...sification.htm
__________________
- Subscribe to my Lawn Care Marketing Blog Feed and get daily tips sent to you. Free!
Download your Free trial of Gopher Lawn Care Software.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-24-2007, 06:51 PM
JMM0254
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

So, has anyone here ever hired someone to run a plow and pay cash or 1099? I answered NO to 1-16 except for #4, #14 is a yes and no, because they bring all the other tools necessary (clothing, snow shovels, etc.) (I supply the mode of transportation only and the clients) and YES to 17-20.

Would it be better to just try to find someone with their own plow and hire them? I worry then that it will cost me as much to pay them to service the accounts as I make on each one, and also that they will take all clients themselves for next year. Both snow and mow/trim accounts (as most of my customers have both services).

Not trying to "beat a dead horse here", just looking to make an educated decision. Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-24-2007, 07:11 PM
Steve's Avatar
Steve Steve is online now
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 37,361
Rep Power: 10
Steve has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Quote[/b] ]So, has anyone here ever hired someone to run a plow and pay cash or 1099? I answered NO to 1-16 except for #4, #14 is a yes and no, because they bring all the other tools necessary (clothing, snow shovels, etc.) (I supply the mode of transportation only and the clients) and YES to 17-20.
Has any other lco ever hired someone to plow and paid them on a 1099? Sure, they do it all the time. I just happened to see the down side of it the other day and wow it was painful to watch when the IRS tells you, you need to fork over back taxes plus interest plus penalties.

Right now there is a big lawsuit going on with FEDEX Ground and their staff, whom FEDEX claims are contractors while the 'contractors are suing to say they are really employees and demand FEDEX pay employment benefits retroactively.

Read more on this case here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Quote[/b] ]Would it be better to just try to find someone with their own plow and hire them?
Ideally yes, if you wanted them to be a sub-contractor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Quote[/b] ]I worry then that it will cost me as much to pay them to service the accounts as I make on each one,
I can totally understand your position. This is why it is so difficult to compete with others who don't play by rules.

Quote:
Originally Posted by [b
Quote[/b] ]and also that they will take all clients themselves for next year. Both snow and mow/trim accounts (as most of my customers have both services).
You can have sub-contractors sign non-compete agreements so they can't steal your accounts.
__________________
- Subscribe to my Lawn Care Marketing Blog Feed and get daily tips sent to you. Free!
Download your Free trial of Gopher Lawn Care Software.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-25-2007, 12:04 AM
pmblair
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hmmmmm... I have worked for some companies and some of my friends and family have worked for companies in the past where we had to 1099, but after reading that, it would appear we should have been classified as employees and not contractors.

Interesting.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-25-2007, 01:05 AM
Steve's Avatar
Steve Steve is online now
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 37,361
Rep Power: 10
Steve has disabled reputation
Default

Oh yea it's so easy for an employer to hand out 1099 forms and say you are a sub-contractor, but that doesn't make it legal.

It's fascinating stuff to know.
__________________
- Subscribe to my Lawn Care Marketing Blog Feed and get daily tips sent to you. Free!
Download your Free trial of Gopher Lawn Care Software.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump

» Recent Threads
  RatingTitle, Username, & Date Last Post Replies Views
Share your stolen...
SGL1
05-27-2015 09:05 PM
Today 08:35 AM
by Chilehead
9 125
Hello All
HappyGrass
05-27-2015 10:10 PM
Today 05:05 AM
by Sprinkler Buddy
3 82
big job for me....need...
holymoly
Yesterday 06:15 AM
Today 03:42 AM
by holymoly
4 101
What a JERK!
Chilehead
05-06-2015 08:13 AM
Yesterday 03:13 PM
by HappyGrass
16 816
5 things you would...
Steve
09-11-2008 08:53 AM
Yesterday 03:02 PM
by HappyGrass
5 2,159
how to make customers...
Bradcook21
05-27-2015 05:04 PM
Yesterday 12:31 PM
by Steve
5 123
Equipment dealers
mattthelawnguy
05-21-2015 04:33 PM
Yesterday 12:20 PM
by Steve
6 211
Things your lawn care...
Steve
05-27-2015 11:48 AM
05-27-2015 11:48 AM
by Steve
0 65
I can't believe people...
ExtremeLawncareServices
05-25-2015 10:29 AM
05-27-2015 11:45 AM
by jrs.landscaping
9 266
Show us your stripes
Just for Cuts
05-21-2015 03:07 PM
05-27-2015 11:35 AM
by Steve
5 196
Pissed off customers
stonegatedesigns
05-26-2015 05:29 PM
05-27-2015 11:26 AM
by Steve
3 136
Great start to the season
jcurr33
05-25-2015 08:49 PM
05-26-2015 01:50 PM
by Steve
2 100
uploading video on here?
holymoly
05-24-2015 08:13 AM
05-26-2015 01:37 PM
by Steve
2 101
new here ! need help
pgrace
05-23-2015 11:29 PM
05-26-2015 01:35 PM
by Steve
1 119
What's your next...
Steve
05-15-2015 11:54 AM
05-26-2015 01:25 PM
by Steve
14 413
problems with a customer
LawnCareMan280
05-19-2015 06:28 PM
05-26-2015 01:22 PM
by Steve
5 232
More Rain or Less?
Steve
05-20-2015 12:06 PM
05-24-2015 04:37 PM
by SGL1
12 301
Irrigation
pboy8634
02-21-2010 12:46 PM
05-22-2015 10:05 PM
by biglee
25 8,486
Beginner Mistakes:...
Steve
01-31-2007 11:45 AM
05-22-2015 09:58 PM
by biglee
37 9,222
Peace garden ideas
SGL1
05-13-2015 03:15 PM
05-21-2015 07:51 PM
by avetslawncare
16 549
These are the days on...
ExtremeLawncareServices
01-11-2015 10:41 AM
05-20-2015 09:18 PM
by ExtremeLawncareServices
84 6,898
Total yard rehab
SGL1
04-23-2015 03:59 PM
05-19-2015 08:22 PM
by SGL1
15 842
Say Hello !!!
Steve
03-19-2007 11:18 AM
05-19-2015 04:12 PM
by NinaMarie86
1,223 390,387
New Lawn Service
carmelitaslawnservice
05-19-2015 10:02 AM
05-19-2015 02:51 PM
by Steve
1 144
Landscaper Jailed After...
SGL1
05-18-2015 08:15 AM
05-19-2015 02:37 PM
by Steve
5 248
Pictures of commercial...
avetslawncare
04-01-2015 09:47 PM
05-19-2015 02:29 PM
by Steve
38 2,058
feeling like im being...
Bradcook21
05-17-2015 07:33 AM
05-19-2015 02:11 PM
by Steve
6 255
good news yesterday
Bradcook21
05-17-2015 07:08 AM
05-19-2015 06:16 AM
by Bradcook21
3 184
ignition coil
jasonw
05-12-2015 05:31 PM
05-18-2015 12:07 PM
by Steve
3 300
Anyone need help? I have...
biglee
05-06-2015 12:22 PM
05-18-2015 12:06 PM
by Steve
13 735
Big (to me) mulch job
tl757
04-23-2015 05:32 PM
05-15-2015 08:46 PM
by biglee
22 1,547
big dog mowers?
Bradcook21
05-13-2015 04:03 PM
05-14-2015 10:55 AM
by Steve
4 327
Small HOA Bid
lxarth
05-06-2015 10:37 PM
05-13-2015 11:55 AM
by Steve
9 552
New company in Michigan
SEM
04-24-2015 09:27 PM
05-13-2015 11:51 AM
by Steve
11 679
Fired for refusing to...
Mr. Mow
05-09-2015 06:15 AM
05-12-2015 01:36 PM
by Steve
6 545
I have ZERO confidence...
Just for Cuts
05-01-2015 04:24 PM
05-12-2015 03:53 AM
by jrs.landscaping
31 1,152
landscape insurance
clarkslawn
03-30-2015 10:14 PM
05-11-2015 01:15 PM
by Steve
6 1,063
String trim BEFORE mow...
Mr. Mow
04-12-2015 08:13 AM
05-10-2015 07:50 PM
by ExtremeLawncareServices
9 1,099
Bought my first STIHL...
Mr. Mow
05-09-2015 06:29 AM
05-10-2015 08:36 AM
by Mr. Mow
9 452
advice wanted please and...
CHenricks
05-07-2015 08:40 PM
05-08-2015 04:20 PM
by CHenricks
7 472
Hello
SallyBorowicz
05-06-2015 11:14 AM
05-08-2015 02:21 PM
by Steve
3 375
Mower Advice
tl757
05-06-2015 02:31 PM
05-08-2015 01:45 PM
by Steve
6 509
Home today...Still...
biglee
05-06-2015 11:59 AM
05-07-2015 12:06 PM
by biglee
2 378
I'm Back With The Best...
aduttonater
02-21-2015 12:41 AM
05-07-2015 11:17 AM
by Steve
79 4,056
color fliers?
holymoly
04-18-2015 02:32 PM
05-07-2015 10:57 AM
by Steve
16 1,074
Looking good
mrsmichigan
05-06-2015 09:47 AM
05-07-2015 10:53 AM
by Steve
1 317
What are your biggest...
Steve
05-05-2015 01:24 PM
05-07-2015 10:52 AM
by Steve
2 372
is craiglist good to...
JBENI
04-16-2015 11:11 AM
05-06-2015 07:15 PM
by TheYardGuy
12 1,159
Go daddy web site and...
jcurr33
05-04-2015 06:00 PM
05-05-2015 11:57 AM
by Steve
2 400
How busy are you now?
Steve
05-04-2015 01:10 PM
05-05-2015 11:47 AM
by Steve
4 435
» Popular Tags
aerocore apartment bid apartment lawn care estimate applying auger billy goat brushcutter blowout bob villa bush commercial deliquentaccounts demonstration design ditches door hangers employee problems estimate foreman free advertising google growing a lawn care business hardscapes how to hydraulic jobs john deere quik trac landscape landscape services landscaping training lawn lawn aeration lawn care lawn care busines plan managing a lawn care business marketing marketing secrets more customers business mulch new business ordinance patio install per hour service pricing pto scag scag v-ride scripts secrets to landscaping sell the vision shell shreaded snow plowing sq ft starting a lawn care business steep lawns swzt theft toro toro grand stand tractor auger trailer trailer mate pro up sell employee web design website website design winterization won't return wood wright stander rh
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.1.0

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:49 PM.


(C) 2011 Riggs Publications - Terms of use & Privacy Policy

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:49 PM.

(C) 2011 Riggs Publications - Terms of use & Privacy Policy