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View Full Version : Echo PB-413H giving me problems


Fresh Cut
05-18-2009, 09:05 AM
A while ago I was having really bad problems with it and I needed to finish a customers yard so I pulled the spark plug out and put in the only extra plug I had with me, and extra spark plug for my Toro 36" walk behind.

It started up, ran good enough for me to finish the yard, and I kept it in.


Here lately, it has been cutting off on me and hard to start afterwards. It was doing fine for a while.
It will cut off on me while I'm blowing full throttle and I won't be able to start it for a while. I slide the choke lever all the way up, pull it a couple times and it sounds like it wants to start. Then I pull the choke lever down about halfway and pull, and it starts sometimes... but then putts out on me. Sometimes it won't even start this way, it just sounds like it wants to start when I have the choke lever all the way up.

That same customer gave me some Amsoil 2 cycle oil that I mixed and have been using in everything I have that's 2-cycle every since. I like it, my Redmax Trimmer seems to like it as well. Since I used the last of it yesterday and can't buy it locally, I'll have to wait on the customer to get some more because he's a dealer, I'm going back to regular 2 cycle oil that I usually see at the gas station today.

I'm telling all this because I don't know what the problem is. I'm not sure if it's the fuel mixture, if the blower is running too lean or rich, or if having a different spark plug in it is causing it to act differently.

I'm leaning towards it being the spark plug because my Toro 36" walk behind isn't a 2 cycle machine, it uses straight gas. So possibly the plug worked temporarily but can't be depended on long term as it wasn't for this application.

Thanks in advance for advice.
Fresh Cut

VPS Lawn Care
05-18-2009, 09:58 AM
It sounds to me that you are having a problem with your carb, or have you changed the air filter lately, they love a fresh air filter, i change mine weekly, very important, i have the same unit, since new and never a problem. Gl

Fresh Cut
05-18-2009, 10:39 AM
Air filter is relatively clean.

I have no idea how to adjust the carb on it. Is it hard or do you suggest taking it to somebody to do it for me?

I really need help on this. I think I'm going to take that spark plug out and buy the plug for its application.

SuperiorPower
05-18-2009, 01:24 PM
First, start out with replacing the spark plug. If that does not cut it, it may need to have the carb rebuilt and adjusted. Adjusting the carburetor is not something I would recommend doing unless you have proper training because you can get one out to far and the other in too far and never get it right unless you know the base setting. Plus, by now most equipment have limiter caps so you don't know where you are at anyway.

So a recap, Spark plug then pursue the fuel issue. It could be a diaphragm problem or a plugged fuel filter, fuel line leaking, or any number of other fuel isues (if it is a fuel problem).

Good luck,
Eli

justin_time
05-18-2009, 03:06 PM
I see your problem, you don't have a Stihl ;)

CheapNEasy
05-18-2009, 08:04 PM
To adjust the air fuel mixture screws, run get a small screw driver, using two fingers to not run them in to TIGHT! Run both in until stop, back both out 1/4 of a turn. Prime/Choke, pull 2 times, unchoke, pull once and commence work as usual!

:)

Hope this helps you! *Check the plug too though*

SuperiorPower
05-19-2009, 08:58 PM
To adjust the air fuel mixture screws, run get a small screw driver, using two fingers to not run them in to TIGHT! Run both in until stop, back both out 1/4 of a turn. Prime/Choke, pull 2 times, unchoke, pull once and commence work as usual!

:)

Hope this helps you! *Check the plug too though*

Like I said before, this is only something that a trained technician should do. Typically, there will be a limiter cap on it and you will be no better off than before. And God forbid you remove the cap, and you don't know what you are doing (read, are trained to do so) you can really screw it up. To make matter worse, if you are able to adjust it to where the blower runs, you may very well have adjusted it to the point where it will burn up. Yes, this is possible. The mixture screws are "limited" for a reason. Here are several of those reasons, among other reasons, for the environmental reasons to prevent it from being set to "rich" to where it uses to much fuel, loses power, fouls plugs, creates extra and unnecessary carbon, or even prevent it from starting under certain conditions.

Another reason is to prevent the wrong combination which can cause it to over heat, or under lubricate, or not run at all. As I indicated, the correct combination setting is required for the machine to operate properly. Besides the above mentioned results of improper adjustment, like I mentioned earlier, you can destroy your machine by burning it up!!! I think a tuneup fee at a local servicing dealer would be considerably cheaper!!!

With 4 cycle engines you can cause extreme damage to the engine if it runs too rich (and you would never know it is too rich) because too much gas washes the oil off the cylinders causing it to not be lubricated properly.

For those reasons, I would highly recommend NEVER ADJUSTING a carburetor, 2 cycle or 4 Cycle, unless you are properly trained to do so. As a mechanic, for the above mentioned reasons, I have to respectfully disagree with CheapNEasy.

SuperiorPower
05-19-2009, 09:03 PM
A while ago I was having really bad problems with it and I needed to finish a customers yard so I pulled the spark plug out and put in the only extra plug I had with me, and extra spark plug for my Toro 36" walk behind.

A brand new, perfectly good spark plug, installed in the wrong machine, may not function. I have seen on several occasions where a wrong spark plug was installed in a machine, tho there was nothing wrong with the plug, the machine would not start or would start extremely hard. I have also seen they would run rough, just because of a spark plug. For the price of a spark plug, you can't take a chance. Try a new plug. If this does not do it, take it to a local servicing dealer whom you trust, preferably one who sells and services Echo. And, no, Home Depot does not qualify as a servicing dealer......


Good luck,
Eli

CheapNEasy
05-19-2009, 09:59 PM
I in no way was meaning for him to not have a certified tech inspect and adjust the unit, I was mearly giving factory specs for the unit and a temporary fix to finish a job if needed in the future. I myself am a certified GM mechanic for 10 years now and certified small engine mechanic for 2 years.

He can use the factory presets to complete a job as needed. As for adjusting to much, that is why I specifically stated the use Two fingers and LIGHTLY adjust..... With two fingers it is rather hard to break the stops on the adjustment screws.

CheapNEasy
05-19-2009, 11:50 PM
I do apologize, seems I misread the post and gave you specifications for Stihl unit.

Here is a link to the Owners Manual for your specific unit. There will be a section to reset to factory conditions and how to properly set them.

http://www.echo-usa.com/pdf/documentation/PB413HTes02_012703.pdf

CHEESE2009
05-20-2009, 12:40 AM
I see your problem, you don't have a Stihl ;)

lol, the post that caught my eye

skeltor
05-21-2009, 06:11 PM
If it wont start after it dies check for spark. When a coil goes out it will die when warm. When allowed to cool will restart and act up then die again.

justin_time
05-21-2009, 07:52 PM
lol, the post that caught my eye

Why do you think I have a big Stihl sticker on my trailer ;)

Steve W
05-21-2009, 08:32 PM
Like I said before, this is only something that a trained technician should do. Typically, there will be a limiter cap on it and you will be no better off than before. And God forbid you remove the cap, and you don't know what you are doing (read, are trained to do so) you can really screw it up. To make matter worse, if you are able to adjust it to where the blower runs, you may very well have adjusted it to the point where it will burn up. Yes, this is possible. The mixture screws are "limited" for a reason. Here are several of those reasons, among other reasons, for the environmental reasons to prevent it from being set to "rich" to where it uses to much fuel, loses power, fouls plugs, creates extra and unnecessary carbon, or even prevent it from starting under certain conditions.

Another reason is to prevent the wrong combination which can cause it to over heat, or under lubricate, or not run at all. As I indicated, the correct combination setting is required for the machine to operate properly. Besides the above mentioned results of improper adjustment, like I mentioned earlier, you can destroy your machine by burning it up!!! I think a tuneup fee at a local servicing dealer would be considerably cheaper!!!

With 4 cycle engines you can cause extreme damage to the engine if it runs too rich (and you would never know it is too rich) because too much gas washes the oil off the cylinders causing it to not be lubricated properly.

For those reasons, I would highly recommend NEVER ADJUSTING a carburetor, 2 cycle or 4 Cycle, unless you are properly trained to do so. As a mechanic, for the above mentioned reasons, I have to respectfully disagree with CheapNEasy.
__________________
Eli
Owner, Superior Power Equipment

Eli, Do you wear Hush Puupy shoes?LOL! sorry thats just an inside joke.
I tell ya dude you speak like an older man. But in a good way. I guess. :D

SuperiorPower
05-21-2009, 09:25 PM
Eli, Do you wear Hush Puupy shoes?LOL! sorry thats just an inside joke.
I tell ya dude you speak like an older man. But in a good way. I guess. :D

No hush puppies here. :) I take it that was a compliment? If so, Thanks! If not, this is just who I am.:D

Steve W
05-21-2009, 09:27 PM
that was a compliment, Its all GOOD!

SuperiorPower
05-21-2009, 09:42 PM
Thank you brother!!

Fresh Cut
06-01-2009, 11:41 PM
I got me another blower!!!

Redmax EBZ8000!!! Found it at like the 5th or 6th pawn shop I went to today. They had $369 on it, I asked if it was negotiable, they said 'yea'.

I got 'em down to $265!! :eek: :cool:

The choke lever is loose and kinda flops around. I have to hold it out when pulling the cord, but it starts first pull most times, others its on the 2nd pull.


One problem it does have is that when I pull the throttle to wide open I hear the engine go up and down, on its own :confused:. Like it won't stay wide open or something, even when I'm not moving the throttle it fluctuates.

What's up w/ that?! :confused::confused:

SuperiorPower
06-02-2009, 01:03 AM
I got me another blower!!!

Redmax EBZ8000!!! Found it at like the 5th or 6th pawn shop I went to today. They had $369 on it, I asked if it was negotiable, they said 'yea'.

I got 'em down to $265!! :eek: :cool:

The choke lever is loose and kinda flops around. I have to hold it out when pulling the cord, but it starts first pull most times, others its on the 2nd pull.


One problem it does have is that when I pull the throttle to wide open I hear the engine go up and down, on its own :confused:. Like it won't stay wide open or something, even when I'm not moving the throttle it fluctuates.

What's up w/ that?! :confused::confused:

Its hard to tell without actually hearing it but it sounds like it may be an air leak which messes with your air/fuel mixture. If its not that then it is likely the carburetor needs rebuilt. I don't know what the charge is where you are but I personally charge only about $40-$50 for a carburetor rebuild which includes removing carb, rebuild, reinstall and adjusting while running. If you can financially, I would recommend taking the $100 that you saved and having it checked out and tuned up if that is what it takes. Likely a shop could look at it and tell you what it takes without charging you an arm and a leg.

Good luck and let me know what happens. Congrats on finding what you wanted!
Eli

Fresh Cut
06-03-2009, 09:12 AM
Its hard to tell without actually hearing it but it sounds like it may be an air leak which messes with your air/fuel mixture. If its not that then it is likely the carburetor needs rebuilt. I don't know what the charge is where you are but I personally charge only about $40-$50 for a carburetor rebuild which includes removing carb, rebuild, reinstall and adjusting while running. If you can financially, I would recommend taking the $100 that you saved and having it checked out and tuned up if that is what it takes. Likely a shop could look at it and tell you what it takes without charging you an arm and a leg.

Good luck and let me know what happens. Congrats on finding what you wanted!
Eli

Hey, thanks for the reply.

I remember noticing a short piece of yellow wire on the carb when the blower was sitting on the pawn shop's shelf, it was really just sitting on it, it wasn't tied or affixed so I disregarded it.
Turns out that whoever had it must have used that wire to hold the choke lever in once they got it started.

The fluctuation came from the choke lever flopping up and down, yes, it's that loose, while the blower is running. The vibration from the blower makes it do that.
Solution: I tied a short piece of trimmer line around it and it was solid.... until.

After my first yard yesterday I noticed that it wasn't wide open when I pulled the throttle all the way back. What was weird is that I had already started it up that morning and played with it when I figured out about the choke lever and I could notice a significant difference in the wide open from before and the wide open on my first yard. I suspected first that it was the fuel mix since it was the obvious unknown variable.

Solution: It still had the same mix in it that it came with from the pawn shop... wasn't much so I ran it out and put some in from my buddy's truck. Ran like a velociraptor! Strong.

I guess the mix that the previous owner used was too lean. :confused:

ritchiem
06-03-2009, 03:42 PM
Older Echo's were famous for loose choke levers....as well as the exhaust port clogging up on ya. 99.9% of the time if you loose power or poor running engine on your trimmer you'll want to pull off the muffler and scrape out all the carbon buildup from the head...be careful as the heads are made of aluminum.

Glad to hear you solved your problem though.

Fresh Cut
06-05-2009, 05:37 PM
Older Echo's were famous for loose choke levers....as well as the exhaust port clogging up on ya. 99.9% of the time if you loose power or poor running engine on your trimmer you'll want to pull off the muffler and scrape out all the carbon buildup from the head...be careful as the heads are made of aluminum.

Glad to hear you solved your problem though.

The new blower I got is a Redmax EBZ8000

SuperiorPower
06-05-2009, 06:56 PM
Solution: It still had the same mix in it that it came with from the pawn shop... wasn't much so I ran it out and put some in from my buddy's truck. Ran like a velociraptor! Strong.

I guess the mix that the previous owner used was too lean. :confused:

Most likely the problem with your fuel hinged on old gas. They say that after about one month or so, even 91 octane fuel can be reduced to less than 87 octane. This is a good reason to keep your gas fresh. The best way to do that is to only buy a small amount of gas (about what you would expect to use in a month or less). They recommend to not store gas more than 1 month. Glad you found the problem and it was no big deal. good luck with your new (new to you) blower.