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picframer
04-22-2009, 07:29 PM
I will just throw this out.

We are quite a few weeks behind some of you in the grass growing season, it would be at least three to four more weeks before mowing even starts.

It seems most of us are in the same boat, there are a lot of start up's out there and are driving the pricing to a level we have to look at other services we can provide.

For me it has been mini excavation work, mainly installing drain tile, we are swamped with orders.

Anyhow I decided long ago to make our company 100% organic, lots of reasons including local laws, all of our products are sprayed on, I have Gilmore and Fimco sprayers, various sizes from backpack to a 30 gallon tow. We can only spray just before or during a rain, we had 137 contracts for spraying and started yesterday as we haven't had rain since the snow left.

Today I personally sprayed to help the guys out, we are having an extreme rain fall so conditions are ideal for the product and we wanted to get the orders done.

For what I am charging and getting without an issue, an employee would have to mow 31 average sized lawns (at our rates, not the low ball stuff) in one day to equal the same profit, we all know that no one can mow that many properties in one day.

So I throw it out for your consideration, I am using Natures Magic, I did a lot of research and I order it out of Florida, should be a lot cheaper for you folks in the USA and it's an amazing product. This may be another revenue stream for you, it's is working for us, 90% of these 137 orders came from a flyer on my table at the farmers market where we sell woodworking products on Saturday's, I have not yet advertised this service yet as I am still waiting for more staff, so mid next week 3,500 flyers will hit the middle to upper class areas of the city, I use Canada Post and I can almost narrow the drop to the street I want, which I did, I know the city well enough to know which streets are a waste of money.

Andy

Steve
04-22-2009, 07:45 PM
Andy,

What kind of licenses or permits are required to spray organic (what would you even call that) Organic herbacide? Fertilizer?

swstout
04-22-2009, 08:05 PM
I went to the site (based from Buffalo, NY?). In the FAQsection if found the 1 teaspoon to 1 gallon formula.

For 1,000 sq ft it says use 2.4 oz. so it looks like I would need about 6 gallons oer 1,000 sq ft. Is that correct?

Do you use this in place of fertilizer or as a suppliment?

Does it do anyhing for raising pH? I checked a job yesterday that has a pH of 4.5. Very little grass and a lot of moss. About 9,000 sq dt with 15 pine trees.

What would you charge per 1,000 sq ft?

Steve

picframer
04-22-2009, 08:23 PM
I went to the site (based from Buffalo, NY?). In the FAQsection if found the 1 teaspoon to 1 gallon formula.

For 1,000 sq ft it says use 2.4 oz. so it looks like I would need about 6 gallons oer 1,000 sq ft. Is that correct?

Do you use this in place of fertilizer or as a suppliment?

Does it do anyhing for raising pH? I checked a job yesterday that has a pH of 4.5. Very little grass and a lot of moss. About 9,000 sq dt with 15 pine trees.

What would you charge per 1,000 sq ft?

Steve

Steve, I use all their products, for a spring spray we are using the Aerify Plus mixed with the lawn fertilizer mized with the dethatch, no core aeration required yet I get the same rate, less work, no mess and much faster.

For the fertilizer I mix 10 OZ to the gallon, every product is different amounts. To adjust the PH I would use a liquid lime spray we have, the moss could be a host of issues, I would lime, use the three products above and overseed, I use Canada Green, customers have a lawn in 10 days, it's a pretty crazy grass, friggin stuff will grow on rocks, well one type does.

To answer your question to spray just fertilizer on 1,000 sq/ft I charge $ 38.50, price goes up for each product added and I educate every client on what we suggest and why and what it will do. If you live out of the way price goes up, min price per spray is $35.00. I did a couple today that were over $300.00 and the client never batted an eye, at least I get a chance to work these lawn tractors I bought, in an out in no time, takes me 30 min to do a 3 acre property, that is from the time I arrive until I am walking away, payment is upon arrival, no exceptions or a credit card must be supplied and is processed the morning of the spray....in short I have no receivables and never will.

picframer
04-22-2009, 08:27 PM
Andy,

What kind of licenses or permits are required to spray organic (what would you even call that) Organic herbacide? Fertilizer?

Because it's a certified Organic spray no license, at least here is required and they are crazy strict in Halifax which includes an area about 10 miles outside the city limits all the way around, they call it HRM. In the last two days we have been checked twice by by-law officers, as soon as they see you spraying anything they are on you, no issues at all, staff keep on spraying and tell the officer to go read the product information sheet that is in the truck or trailer.

picframer
04-22-2009, 08:40 PM
I went to the site (based from Buffalo, NY?). In the FAQsection if found the 1 teaspoon to 1 gallon formula.

For 1,000 sq ft it says use 2.4 oz. so it looks like I would need about 6 gallons oer 1,000 sq ft. Is that correct?

Do you use this in place of fertilizer or as a suppliment?

Does it do anyhing for raising pH? I checked a job yesterday that has a pH of 4.5. Very little grass and a lot of moss. About 9,000 sq dt with 15 pine trees.

What would you charge per 1,000 sq ft?

Steve

Steve, there is 128oz in a gallon, so that is 12.8 sprays of 1,000 sq ft using 10oz to the gallon of water, make sure there is no chlorine in the water, I am on a well so everything is filled here and I have a pile of 5 gallon plastic containers we bought for next to nothing at a surplus store.

There is no risk of burning the grass at all with these products.

Steve
04-22-2009, 08:45 PM
For those that just no nothing about this. What do these organic sprays do? Are they weed killers? Do they fertilize the lawn?

swstout
04-22-2009, 08:48 PM
To answer your question to spray just fertilizer on 1,000 sq/ft I charge $ 38.50, price goes up for each product added and I educate every client on what we suggest and why and what it will do. If you live out of the way price goes up, min price per spray is $35.00. I did a couple today that were over $300.00 and the client never batted an eye, at least I get a chance to work these lawn tractors I bought, in an out in no time, takes me 30 min to do a 3 acre property, that is from the time I arrive until I am walking away, payment is upon arrival, no exceptions or a credit card must be supplied and is processed the morning of the spray....in short I have no receivables and never will.

Thank you (I think)! Now I have more to think about! We'll I like research anyway. I saw a used 30 gallon tow behind sprayer today at a rental company that is gowing out of business. Back there tomorrow. Strange that you made this post today! Is a higher power trying to tell me something?

Steve

picframer
04-22-2009, 08:53 PM
For those that just no nothing about this. What do these organic sprays do? Are they weed killers? Do they fertilize the lawn?

Best to go to their Site, in short I use their fertilizer, the Aerify Plus and the Bio Dethacher. http://www.natureslawn.com/index.html My sole goal with these products is catering to the I have to have a lawn as nice as the guy next door client, which in the city is the majority. In a few days when one of our clients lawns is green and a neighbour or someone down the street is wondering what they did and ask, I know we will be called. I left a few nice post card type flyer as did the staff with every customer.

I let my customers research the product on top of what I tell/told them, they could buy it for the same price as I do but no one has done the math, except for me, I make more from spraying than anything else we do. I knew quite quickly I was onto something when I started quoting and no one yet has said anything about the price, which shocks me.

Their products do it all and they seem to have the best track record based on my research.

The Aerify Plus will break down the clay in the soil and it opens up the ground for the roots to grow, the owner used to core aerate and did it for 20 years, when he started using this product he was blown away. I will know clients reactions in a few days, we only started spraying yesterday and this is supposed to be a nice warm sunny weekend, lawns should take off over night.

Steve
04-22-2009, 08:59 PM
That is very interesting!

Is there some kind of schedule you follow with this? Applying one mixture at a certain time of the year and another mixture at another time?

Or do you spray them all at the same time?

picframer
04-22-2009, 09:23 PM
Thank you (I think)! Now I have more to think about! We'll I like research anyway. I saw a used 30 gallon tow behind sprayer today at a rental company that is gowing out of business. Back there tomorrow. Strange that you made this post today! Is a higher power trying to tell me something?

Steve

Could be:)

I am the type that will research, if it seems like a good business decision I will ask a few people what they think, if it comes back positive I buy the equipment and go for it. It doesn't always work, all these new mowers I have are a classic example of a mistake, but I quickly react and never give up.

For me the mini excavation and now the spraying are taking off, we have to keep looking for things we can offer that the competition is not, I now have two things and am working on two more, still in the research phase so I won't get into what they are.

Good Luck bud, give it a try, you too may have amazing results, one of their clients in New York has over 2,000 lawn care customers, I have spoken to him many times, he built his company on these products, that works for me.

picframer
04-22-2009, 09:27 PM
That is very interesting!

Is there some kind of schedule you follow with this? Applying one mixture at a certain time of the year and another mixture at another time?

Or do you spray them all at the same time?

That is what I love about this product, you can mix them and spray all at once, it's quick and the results are very quick being a liquid.

Don't forget I have only started this business but it is my intention to sell these same clients again in the fall and because they will have excellent results now, I believe they will say yes by all means spray. I am educating them now to that sale saying it would be an excellent idea to spray again in the fall.

Steve
04-22-2009, 09:32 PM
Oh ok, so one spraying in the spring and then one spraying in the fall ideally?

How much would it cost in product to spray an averaged size lawn?

How much should a lawn care business owner charge for that service?

What would you say would be the average lawn size in sqft?

swstout
04-23-2009, 02:07 AM
Steve, I use all their products, for a spring spray we are using the Aerify Plus mixed with the lawn fertilizer mized with the dethatch, no core aeration required yet I get the same rate, less work, no mess and much faster.

For the fertilizer I mix 10 OZ to the gallon, every product is different amounts. To adjust the PH I would use a liquid lime spray we have, the moss could be a host of issues, I would lime, use the three products above and overseed, I use Canada Green, customers have a lawn in 10 days, it's a pretty crazy grass, friggin stuff will grow on rocks, well one type does.



Where do you find the liquid lime? I didn't find it on the site.

The moss, according to the Dept. of Agriculture here won't grow on soil with a pH higher than 5.0. He gave me the actual name of the moss but I can't remember it. The important thing about it is that I can point it out and tell the customer that it won't grow on soil over a pH of 5.0 and that most grass wants as pH of 7.0. Makes soil conditioning sales easier. The lite green moss really shows up.

Steve

picframer
04-23-2009, 05:38 AM
Where do you find the liquid lime? I didn't find it on the site.

The moss, according to the Dept. of Agriculture here won't grow on soil with a pH higher than 5.0. He gave me the actual name of the moss but I can't remember it. The important thing about it is that I can point it out and tell the customer that it won't grow on soil over a pH of 5.0 and that most grass wants as pH of 7.0. Makes soil conditioning sales easier. The lite green moss really shows up.

Steve

I believe it is the Natures Magic product that will level the PH at 7, I would have to go read but am pretty certain.

We have one of the largest lime deposits in the country just outside the city limits, they sell lime in every form you could imagine, anyhow I buy my liquid lime from them, its really cheap on the cost side.

picframer
04-23-2009, 05:43 AM
Oh ok, so one spraying in the spring and then one spraying in the fall ideally?

How much would it cost in product to spray an averaged size lawn?

How much should a lawn care business owner charge for that service?

What would you say would be the average lawn size in sqft?

Really depends on the customers lawn but the average lawn, two sprays a year for where I live, in some of the harsh climates it could be more often.

As for cost it depends on what is being applied, I wrote a program, enter the square footage, select the product, enter the postal code for travel time and it prints a quote but in short you are making a 300%++ profit which is nuts. The only other thing I do with a profit like that is picture framing.

Outside the city where I was spraying yesterday, the average lawn is 1.25 acres, in the city its close to 1,500.

We charge a min of $35.00, I haven't had one lawn that low yet.

picframer
04-23-2009, 05:58 AM
Thank you (I think)! Now I have more to think about! We'll I like research anyway. I saw a used 30 gallon tow behind sprayer today at a rental company that is gowing out of business. Back there tomorrow. Strange that you made this post today! Is a higher power trying to tell me something?

Steve

Steve, if you decide to buy that sprayer, get the model and manufacturer name, some rental companies do not always buy quality, google it and see what users say. There are some sprayers on the market that would be a waste of your money, even if you get it dirt cheap. I try to buy the best even though at times it hurts a bit, the upside is no down time and a machine that will pay for itself many times over.

Steve
04-23-2009, 08:15 PM
For a property that is 1,500 sq ft or so, what type of sprayer do you recommend?

swstout
04-23-2009, 08:27 PM
Steve, if you decide to buy that sprayer, get the model and manufacturer name, some rental companies do not always buy quality, google it and see what users say. There are some sprayers on the market that would be a waste of your money, even if you get it dirt cheap. I try to buy the best even though at times it hurts a bit, the upside is no down time and a machine that will pay for itself many times over.

Thanks for the advise.

When I went back today it was gone. Checked Lowes and Tractor Supply Company (TSC) and found prices from $399.00 to $599.00. When I tried to check Google for comments and reviews I only found ads for Lowes and TSC. No comments!

I ordered the sample pack (3 products) last night and added a "All Natural Green Services" section to my website.

I have 2 4 gallon backpack sprayers to use for now if I get any sales.

Steve

picframer
04-23-2009, 08:34 PM
For a property that is 1,500 sq ft or so, what type of sprayer do you recommend?

Anything 1/2 acre or less is backpack, we use Gilmore and I am very, very pleased I have three of them, 1/2 acre to an acre is a Fimco 8 gallon hand pull sprayer that has a battery that will spray 15 hours before recharging, this sprayer works perfect and we have two, 1 acre plus is a tow sprayer and we have two one is a Fimco and the other is a John Deere, I got a Fimco that must have been made on a bad day as their sprayers are considered the best from what I have read, anyhow the motor went within 30 min of spraying which put us in a bind, we had a number of large properties to spray, I called the company from the field and they offered to rush ship one by courier, it arrived today and I tried it on my own lawn using just water as it's already sprayed, worked great.

I don't want to come across as pushing spraying but I am experiencing amazing almost immediate results and a lot of requests for quotes, we only started spraying Tuesday as we need rain for the products we use, I had 7 emails up to this evening from clients saying they had already noticed results, when you spray the results are almost immediate.

It doesn't have to cost a lot to get started, just buy one backpack and a few products and offer them to your clients, educate yourself well as I have experienced a client that was very well educated in Organic yard care, she really caught me off guard with her knowledge, I enjoyed learning from her being careful with the questions.....anyhow I guess we passed as she hired us to spray, it's a $721.00 job that will take about 1 1/2 hours.

picframer
04-23-2009, 08:43 PM
Thanks for the advise.

When I went back today it was gone. Checked Lowes and Tractor Supply Company (TSC) and found prices from $399.00 to $599.00. When I tried to check Google for comments and reviews I only found ads for Lowes and TSC. No comments!

I ordered the sample pack (3 products) last night and added a "All Natural Green Services" section to my website.

I have 2 4 gallon backpack sprayers to use for now if I get any sales.

Steve

Congradulations Steve!!! I believe you will do well and back pack sprayers are excellent for anything up to an acre, after that one needs something that is powered by something other than your arm, well unless you are into a major workout.

If you have a contract and want an entry tow unit, the guys on the tractor forum buy the one sold by Northern Tool, if $$$ is not an issue Fimco makes what is considered then best by the guys on the tractor forum.

I started spraying Tuesday and have had 7 emails so far from clients that have noticed the quick results.

Let me tell you, if you can get one client to sign on and you do their yard, the product will sell itself, as you know when you spray the results are overnight.

Anyhow if I can help in any way let me know, even with suggested pricing or product feedback, I researched this product to death starting early last fall, I have spoken with numerous lawn car companies in the USA and two of them let me speak to their customers, I personally was sold.

Andy

Steve
04-23-2009, 09:02 PM
It would be great to see some pictures of before and after on the yards sprayed.

picframer
04-23-2009, 09:12 PM
It would be great to see some pictures of before and after on the yards sprayed.

You are right and I am terrible at that even though there is a camera in the truck or I could use my Blackberry......need to tie a string aound my key chain with a reminder or something as we have done a few projects that I wish I had a before and after, including lawn spraying.

However I am doing a two acre place tomorrow that is a mess, I just wrote a note in my company bible to take pictures, I carry this book with me everywhere as it contains notes from conversations prior to input to the laptop.

Steve
04-23-2009, 09:23 PM
Even if you had an area of your own lawn where you could spray a section and then right next to it have a non-sprayed section. You could really show a dramatic difference and that could really help sell!

swstout
04-24-2009, 07:58 PM
Let me tell you, if you can get one client to sign on and you do their yard, the product will sell itself, as you know when you spray the results are overnight.


Andy

I ordered the sample pack Wednesday evening and it was just delivered by UPS. Only 2 days!

Doing my 1st job with it the next rainy day. Customer OK with this.

Steve

picframer
04-24-2009, 08:11 PM
I ordered the sample pack Wednesday evening and it was just delivered by UPS. Only 2 days!

Doing my 1st job with it the next rainy day. Customer OK with this.

Steve

Congradulations Steve, their shipping is very fast, I don't use UPS due to something called a brokerage fee, it's a crazy price so I ship freight.

I'va had nothing but positive comments so far, we have around 18 to do next time it rains, looks like next Friday.

Did you find a pull sprayer? Personally I like the backpacks, but I am not a teenager anymore and after spraying for a few hours the arm starts to complain from the workout:)

Which products are you putting on this clients lawn?

swstout
04-24-2009, 08:18 PM
Congradulations Steve, their shipping is very fast, I don't use UPS due to something called a brokerage fee, it's a crazy price so I ship freight.

I'va had nothing but positive comments so far, we have around 18 to do next time it rains, looks like next Friday.

Did you find a pull sprayer? Personally I like the backpacks, but I am not a teenager anymore and after spraying for a few hours the arm starts to complain from the workout:)

Which products are you putting on this clients lawn?

I'm 60 and definitely not a teenager any more. I wish I had been kinder to my body when I was younger!

I havn't found a pull behind yet and have stopped looking until I have enough business to warrant it. My wife thinks I have too many "toys" already.

Thanks for all the advise.

Steve

Steve
04-24-2009, 08:46 PM
Why does this need to be sprayed when it rains? Can you water a lawn instead after spraying?

swstout
04-24-2009, 09:00 PM
Why does this need to be sprayed when it rains? Can you water a lawn instead after spraying?

You can water it in but:

It is time you could be spending making money
It gives you profitable work when weather is against you for lawn care services.
You can't trust the customer to do the proper watering
On a clear day the sun will evaporate the solutions before they can enter the soil.
Also, you can give the customer a break by doing it during rain. They usually don't mind waiting if it saves them money!

The site http://www.natureslawn.com/magic.php

Another point I am using. They give the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for all their products. The safety of their products is certified.

Steve

Steve

picframer
04-25-2009, 03:50 AM
Two quick things:

You need to spray it in the rain or have the client water it in order to get the product down into the root system, also the Aerify brakes down clay in the soil, if it sits on the grass it does little to nothing, get it down into the root system and wow, the results are excellent within a day or two.

Another selling feature is their products are considered Food Grade in the USA, simply meaning pets or people can be on the lawn as soon as we are finished with no harm.

Andy

swstout
04-25-2009, 04:00 AM
Hi Andy,

You don't sleep either, do You? I haven't slept for more than an hour and a half at one time in years.

I see you on all hours of the day and night.

You explained the rain factor better than I could. Also, I mention the chlorine factor in tap water and point out that rain id free of chlorine.

Steve