PDA

View Full Version : Hey guys, new idea here


PicknBag
07-08-2012, 11:00 PM
Hi everyone, I'm from northern NJ and my Dad and I have invented a machine that may finally do away with the yearly chore of leaf removal for the average homeowner. We'd love some feedback on our product, and we thought this would be great place to have an honest discussion. I posted our demo video at the bottom of this page so you can see it in action and give us some constructive criticism.

Put simply, this machine is the only product ever developed that both picks up and bags leaves - in one simultaneous step. Now, we know there are tons of products out there; however, they all only solve 1 part of the problem - they either help to gather the leaves better, or they help to bag the leaves better. None solve the problem end-to-end. Ours utilizes the ease of use of a lawn sweeper, with the improvement of a bagging capability.

As you watch our video, please know that we acknowledge that our prototype is a HOMEMADE one - this is, it is crude, bulky, and impefect. We ask that you simply look past this and let us know what you think of the concept we are presenting, a machine that allows you to simply walk over your lawn and both sweep up AND bag your leaves in one step (bagging IS half the battle!). After reviewing the video, please let me know your thoughts, I'd be so appreciative to hear what you all have to say and look forward to a good dialogue.

And yes, we do have full US utiility patent coverage - #8,056,177, issued November 2011.

Just either click the link or copy and paste it in your browser to see the Pick 'N Bag Leaf Cart in action. Thanks guys

shereef_hammad@yahoo.com

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1StV-6lW64

SECTLANDSCAPING
07-08-2012, 11:23 PM
for the homeowner this could be useful.

The thing that I like is it uses the curbside bags.

The suggestions I have is you need to mulch the leafs. This would allow more in each bag. If you add another sweeper it will pick up thicker piles and get whats left behind from the first sweep.

The commercial suggestion is it needs to be self propelled and bigger. I'm thinking 6 bags and 48" sweep. You can probably develop that down the line when money comes in.

PicknBag
07-08-2012, 11:34 PM
Asolutely agree, we already have a number of improvements in mind, and a mulcher is on the top of the list. We also will have a "compacting feature", which will compress the leaves that are in the bag for maximum bag capacity.

As for left-behind leaves, the sweeper in the video is a 20 year old craftsman (we did this on a shoestring budget), so of course it won't perform perfectly. Ideally, we want bristles of different lengths, so as to get EVERY leaf, and nice big, manueverable wheels for ease of use. Tons of bells and whistles will be added once it's on the market.

And yea, we definitely think landscapers would like this once there's a commercial version available. We know that having the leaves automatically bagged is of utmost convenience. Instead of having to blow them to the curb. What's more, is some towns now force you to bag them, and there's not a single town that doesn't allow you to bag them. So it's a win win, why not bag them if you can this easily?

Thanks for the comment, i'll be hitting the sack now so if there are any other comments i'll catch them in the AM. Thanks guys, take care.

SECTLANDSCAPING
07-08-2012, 11:40 PM
another quick point is instead of self propelled. Just make it towable.

Steve
07-09-2012, 11:27 AM
I think it is very creative!

Could you tell us a little about how you got through the patent process so if other member out there would like to try and patent something, they could learn from you?

http://www.uspto.gov/web/patents/patog/week46/OG/html/1372-3/US08056177-20111115.html

http://www.uspto.gov/web/patents/patog/week46/OG/html/1372-3/US08056177-20111115-D00000.gif

PicknBag
07-09-2012, 02:08 PM
I want to know what you think. Tell me what you currently use, and what you think of our machine in comparison. I'm seriously looking for a dialogue, and would appreciate it. Again, please forgive the crude nature of the prototype, just let me know what you think about the actual concept of taking leaves directly from the ground and automatically bagging them.

Thanks man

PicknBag
07-09-2012, 02:14 PM
Hey Steve,

Here are a few pointers, hope they help.

First thing is to do a search, to make sure your idea isn't already patent protected by someone else. Patent search can usually run anywhere from $400-$800. Check out uspto.gov and follow the links to try and do a basic search yourself, but it won't show you everything. That's when you have to hire an attorney to do an exhaustive search, but even then you might not find everything

Our attorney cost us about $2,500 to get the patent, but we did a good amount of work ourselves, and we had to fight for ours. Had the lawyer done everything, it would've gotten up to about $4,000-5,000 or so I'd say. Still, in the end we got it, so we were pumped about that. The examiners at the uspto office are incredibly overworked, so sometimes they'll deny you the patent, but they may not have even completely read through your application. My dad took a few weekends of combing through the conflicting patents that the examiner had cited and actually find some major flaws in her reasoning. He put it all together and had the lawyer present it, and about 3 days later, we had our patent. Always know that you can do some of the work yourself, if you're willing.

Hope some of this info helps you, any other questions don't hesitate.

How do most of you out there take care of your leaves every Fall? If this was made professionally, would you find it appealing?

dpld
07-09-2012, 03:47 PM
i think once you refine the machine it might appeal to a homeowner but at that point what will it cost?

i would imagine once you get it steamlined and also chopping the leaves for more quantity of leaves in the bags as well as i would assume you will also have to have a gas motor on it it will cost a pretty penny.

i have a huge vacum set up on my 16 yard dump truck and we blow the leaves to the truck or make a pile and drive the truck to it and there is no way that a refined set up that you are making would be able to keep up.

currently the way i and most landscapers do it is the fastest most economical way to proccess the leaves.
sure my customers have to pay for the disposal but by doing it in a fraction of the time with disposal cost with my current set up i don't think the savings of putting them in bags and leaving it on the curb will justify the extra time and labor.

time is money in this business and when you have to get X amount of properties a day done the fastest way is the most cost effective way because the labor rate is the highest cost.

for 90% of the fall season we use our riders with the bagger set ups and as they load up we just drive over to the rig and dump it on the ground next to it and when we are done we fire up the vac and a couple minutes later the leaves are gone and so are we and off to the next one.
during this time of the year useing the riders it really only adds a few minutes overall to each stop and does not take much more time then just a standard cut.

i think it is a great idea but i think your market will be the homeowner do it yourself crowd vs the professional landscaper.
i live in northern nj as well and i am sure you already know that most landscapers use big big mowers, big trailers and big trucks and just about everything big for that matter.

unfortunately the only way to make money in this business is by doing high volume as efficiently as possible.

in this state it is go big or go home broke.

great idea though, good luck with it and i hope it makes you and your father a million.

Godslapper
07-09-2012, 05:28 PM
I want to know what you think. Tell me what you currently use, and what you think of our machine in comparison. I'm seriously looking for a dialogue, and would appreciate it. Again, please forgive the crude nature of the prototype, just let me know what you think about the actual concept of taking leaves directly from the ground and automatically bagging them.

Thanks man

Any lawnmower with a bag can do a better job than that will be able to do. Even a low end push mower from HD.

CHEESE2009
07-09-2012, 05:58 PM
That is a brilliant prototype!

It's perfect for home owners, as it's rather cost effective!

If you can make it compact for storage, I think you could really make lots and lots of money.

I'd really love to see how this evolves over time. Keep up the good work!

PicknBag
07-09-2012, 06:58 PM
DPLD, thanks for all of the feedback, it really is appreciated. I'll touch on a couple of the things you brought up since you were nice enough to respond.

- Market: this machine will absolutely be geared towards the average homeowner who takes it upon himself every year to clear his lawn of leaves. We know that these homeowners have bought millions of rakes, blowers, lawn sweepers, funnels, clog-free rakes, and tarps over the years. This justifies the need for something to relieve them of this chore, because none of them do the job. Not everyone either wants to, or can afford to pay a landscaper like yourself to do it for them, so they do it themselves. Like you said, that's who we're marketing towards. There are 100M+ single detached homes in the country, so it is a big market.

- Cost: there will be numerous options for the machine. One such option will be to have the machine be entirely manual, that is, as it is pushed forward, the wheels, brush, and conveyor belt will all move. The brush will obviously move the fastest, probably a 5 or 6 to 1 ratio relative to the wheels so as to sweep up every single leaf. This would be the least expensive, and, like any product line, this will have inexpensive options (the Toyotas), or the expensive ones (the Rolls Royce). The Rolls Royce will obviously have all the bells and whistles that someone who can afford, will want.

Now, the machine in the video that you watched is a 20 year old Craftsman that we bought for about $100 20 years ago. The additions that we made to it will certainly add some costs, but nowhere near what we deem to be what the market will bear. We'd think a manual unit can go for about $300-400, and the motorized for a little more. With all of the people we've spoken to, both online and in real life, that is a small cost if they know that for the next 10-15 years, they'll never have to do the backbreaking work of raking, blowing, dragging, and bagging leaves ever again. Just ask anyone with a snowblower, I'm sure they don't regret paying $800 for a nice gas-powered one, and guess what, if you're in northern jersey, you used it maybe twice this year. But it doesn't mean they regret that purchase. With leaves, you know you have to do it every single year, it's guaranteed. So for $400, you will have the job completely taken care of. Besides, there are plenty of reasons as to why bagging the leaves is quickly becoming the preferred method for most towns. Even if your town doesn't require it, it's still the cleanest way to do it. It's just that up until now, it is always such a pain.

Now, like you said, most landscapers will not want this, and I do agree. That's why for starters, we're focusing more on the residential market, because it really is that big. And for most of them, raking leaves is a chore that they're just aching for relief from.

If you just do a quick google search for "leaf gathering/bagging products", you'll quickly find that there are about 50 products on the market in addition to rakes, blowers, and vacuums. While some people might say that means the market is saturated, I'd suggest you take a look at the products. They all solve only 1 part of the problem - they either gather the leaves (blowers, rakes, etc.) or they help to bag (funnels, tarps, big claw hands, etc.). None do both in one step. We came up with this idea as we were using a lawn sweeper and fell in love with its ease of use - we were just walking up and down the lawn picking up leaves. But the problem was, we had to constantly empty the hopper, as it filled up with leaves every 3-4 minutes. that's when we knew it HAD to also bag the leaves, and here we are.


Thanks so much for the feedback, I'd appreciate anyone else who has an opinion to chime in. We do believe that this can do for the leaf raking industry what the snow blower did for snow removal, and we're working our tails off to get it on the market.

Would love to hear more thoughts.

PicknBag
07-09-2012, 07:21 PM
Godslapper,

It's true that a lawnmower with a bag attached will pick up leaves and grass clipping. But let me ask you this, and please answer honestly. After a few passes, and your lawn mower bag is full, what do you do with the contents?

What anyone does is, they have to try and manage to either a) somehow get the leaves/grass into the tall brown paper bags (which is absolutely impossible), or b) if you don't have to bag your leaves, you'll drop the leaves/clippings somewhere, only to return to them later and either drag them on a tarp to your front curb, or a wheelbarrow, or something like that.

So the point is, sure, your lawn mower can chop up and bag the leaves, but it's NOT in the standard brown paper bags that are universally accepted. That, my friend, is the difference between using a lawn mower, and using this.

Now, don't look at our prototype, because that's what it is, a prototype. You have to consider the job this machine will do when professionally made. Not only will the lawn be 100% clear, but the leaves will be IN THE BAG. Job done, in one step, not two.

Thanks for the feedback man, i'm very curious to hear what you think of this as an option now that I've put it that way. Because using a lawn mower with a bag attachment is not as easy as you're making it out to be. It does not really bag the leaves, and you're constantly emptying it into SOMETHING. Might as well do the same walking motion, but bag the leaves too, no?

Hedgemaster
07-09-2012, 07:52 PM
The fact that it bags the leaves IS a selling point.
Those paper bags are such a pain to fill. I'm lucky in that I get very few leaves in my lawn and even so, I don't use those bags - I dump them (I either rake, or bag them with my mower) into a black lawn and leaf trash bag that I've placed inside a large trash can - it's just SO much easier. (even tough it's not "allowed", as we are supposed to "recycle" our leaves)

For large properties, I don't think this machine would be a better option than paying a lawn service, but for smaller lawns, it would probably come in handy.

The thing I hate most about using those bags is the incredibly SMALL amount of leaves you can get in them - even if you spend time "smashing" them down every time you add more. If you're going to make a machine that helps people pick up "large" volumes of leaves, you'd better get more in the bag by either compacting, or mulching to get more volume in there, otherwise you are right back to the argument against using a mower with a bag - you have to stop every 50 feet to remove the quickly-filled leaf bags.

PicknBag
07-09-2012, 08:23 PM
Hedgemaster, thanks for keeping the conversation going man, much appreciated.

You hit the nail on the head - the fact that it bags the leaves is the whole idea, it's what sets this machine apart. We're confident people will see the value.

Now, to your point about mulching and compacting - I'm not sure if you read my prior posts, but that's exactly what we're going to be doing. There will be a mulcher at the top that shreds the leaves as they are dropped in, and there will also be a compacting feature that will tamp the leaves down better than i ever did when i sat on the bags as a kid. Capacity will be king with this machine, we want the end user to change bags as infrequently as possible. Please remember, my dad was clearing the leaves of his own lawn when he came up with this idea, so all of the struggles of the average homeowner will be considered when the final product is designed. Like you guys, we've lived through it.

Larger properties may still see tremendous value from this machine, it'll all depend on the homeowner. The bottom line is, the ideal lot size for the machine as we originally envisioned it is probably 1/2 acre or less. After that, the commercial guys come into play, but there are tens of millions of homes that fall into that "1/2 acre or less category", and this will certainly do the trick. Thanks again for the comment Hedge!

Godslapper
07-09-2012, 10:38 PM
Godslapper,

It's true that a lawnmower with a bag attached will pick up leaves and grass clipping. But let me ask you this, and please answer honestly. After a few passes, and your lawn mower bag is full, what do you do with the contents?

What anyone does is, they have to try and manage to either a) somehow get the leaves/grass into the tall brown paper bags (which is absolutely impossible), or b) if you don't have to bag your leaves, you'll drop the leaves/clippings somewhere, only to return to them later and either drag them on a tarp to your front curb, or a wheelbarrow, or something like that.

So the point is, sure, your lawn mower can chop up and bag the leaves, but it's NOT in the standard brown paper bags that are universally accepted. That, my friend, is the difference between using a lawn mower, and using this.

Now, don't look at our prototype, because that's what it is, a prototype. You have to consider the job this machine will do when professionally made. Not only will the lawn be 100% clear, but the leaves will be IN THE BAG. Job done, in one step, not two.

Thanks for the feedback man, i'm very curious to hear what you think of this as an option now that I've put it that way. Because using a lawn mower with a bag attachment is not as easy as you're making it out to be. It does not really bag the leaves, and you're constantly emptying it into SOMETHING. Might as well do the same walking motion, but bag the leaves too, no?

Hmmm, ok. don't a lot of people put the paper bag in the bag on their riding mower ? I thought that was standard practice. At least around here it is. You might be on to something for people that don't have a rider. Go for it.

PicknBag
07-09-2012, 10:45 PM
So you can attach the standard brown paper bags to your ride-on lawnmower? How are you able to do that, can't say I've ever seen it. Is the bag sitting upright, or horizontal? How do you keep it sturdy?

Godslapper
07-10-2012, 07:36 AM
So you can attach the standard brown paper bags to your ride-on lawnmower? How are you able to do that, can't say I've ever seen it. Is the bag sitting upright, or horizontal? How do you keep it sturdy?

Place the paper bag into the bag on the back of your mower. Most of them fit quite nice. Almost like they were ment to be placed inside the bag on your mower. I get the feeling this has not crossed your mind before.

PicknBag
07-10-2012, 08:10 AM
Are you talking about the commercial mowers that tow the trailer behind it that collects all the grass? I know this is more of a commercial site, so maybe that's what you're talking about.

I wasn't asking that because I think that might jeopardize our idea, I was asking those questions because I find it hard to believe that the bag sits well enough in there for all of the leaves to get in there, the whole compartment really needs to be airtight, or else you might as well not even bother, the leaves will be all over the place, and not in the bag.

Nevertheless, like I've said before, this machine is meant for the millions and millions of smaller-sized lots all over the world - 1/2 acre or less. People with a 1/2 an acre don't use ride-on lawnmowers, and the majority of them don't pay professionals to do their job, so it's not a concern to us. I was just surprised that you claim that way does the job just as well. If it does work for you, then that's great. Out of all of the people we've spoken to who use ride-on mowers, not one of them in 3 years has mentioned this method of doing it. What you're describing is more used by professional landscapers, and that's not who we're targeting anyway. I know that a lot of you on here are pros, so we're coming from different viewpoints. And that's fine, I'm happy to discuss these things with you. I'm really looking for a professional opinion on what this might mean to the average small to medium sized lot homeowner Thanks again.

Godslapper
07-10-2012, 08:31 AM
Years ago, before I had any commercial mowers I had a Cub Cadet 1045. I could bag grass with it. In the fall I would go to the hardware store and buy leaf bags. I would then take two of them and put them inside the bags on my Cub. Sorta like a liner. They fit just fine. I would then suck up the leaves with my Cub. When the bags were full I would drive over to the road, get off my mower go around to the back and take the bags off my riding mower. I would then set the mower bag on the ground and slide the mower bag down off the paper bag. I would then grab the very full paper bag and move to about one foot to the crub. Then I would put the mower bag back on my mower and put another paper bag back inside of that and repeat. I had at the time less than an acre of lawn. Maybe you should just make custom bags to fit any size mower bag. That would help.

willshome
07-10-2012, 08:51 AM
I think you have found a real problem, I hate filling lawn bags!!!! And I know this has been said before but mulching up the leafs is key. The bags on lawn vacs are hard to work with.
what about mulching two time once at the brush and once at the bags? I think this would set you apart from other leaf products, two is always better than one!

PicknBag
07-10-2012, 06:35 PM
Don't you think that the manufacturers of such units, like the Cub Cadet and other Baggers, would RECOMMEND to their customers to do just that - what you did yourself - thus saving them time and aggravation, especially in communities were they are, by law, forced to bag?

Or, homeowners with similar units like yours, would DO what you did, especially that they own the machine.

There's a reason as to why this is not happening in my humble opinion, and that is, these machine are NOT designed to do that, if they were, people would have done it.

By the way, unless your Cub had a compactor (as an option and it is expensive), you would have had to STOP when the bags are full, and hop off and push somehow the leaves down to pick up more leaves, and have to do that often before you go to the curb and unload.

From the top, our unit is:

1) Non motorized, meaning a lot cheaper than any decent motorized mower, not to mention a ridingmowerwith bagging capability.

2) Very few people buy a riding mower with bagging for the market we're looking for, smaller size lots.

3) The ease of use of our unit, just pushing it like a shopping cart, pull the lever to compact the two bags when needed, keep going until filled, STOP, swiftly pull off the filled bags, put them on the cleared lawn, set up 2 more bags, available on board, and keep going.

4) Before you know it, you'll look behind you and see a bunch of filled bags on the cleared lawn, ready to drag to the curb. And you are done.

I'll also have a small on board rake, to use when I need to say, rake leaves and other debris from areas where the unit cannot go, like flower beds etc.

Again, any response from you is appreciated, as usual.

wat5150
07-10-2012, 06:45 PM
Don't you think that the manufacturers of such units, like the Cub Cadet and other Baggers, would RECOMMEND to their customers to do just that - what you did yourself - thus saving them time and aggravation, especially in communities were they are, by law, forced to bag?

Or, homeowners with similar units like yours, would DO what you did, especially that they own the machine.

There's a reason as to why this is not happening in my humble opinion, and that is, these machine are NOT designed to do that, if they were, people would have done it.

By the way, unless your Cub had a compactor (as an option and it is expensive), you would have had to STOP when the bags are full, and hop off and push somehow the leaves down to pick up more leaves, and have to do that often before you go to the curb and unload.

From the top, our unit is:

1) Non motorized, meaning a lot cheaper than any decent motorized mower, not to mention a ridingmowerwith bagging capability.

2) Very few people buy a riding mower with bagging for the market we're looking for, smaller size lots.

3) The ease of use of our unit, just pushing it like a shopping cart, pull the lever to compact the two bags when needed, keep going until filled, STOP, swiftly pull off the filled bags, put them on the cleared lawn, set up 2 more bags, available on board, and keep going.

4) Before you know it, you'll look behind you and see a bunch of filled bags on the cleared lawn, ready to drag to the curb. And you are done.

I'll also have a small on board rake, to use when I need to say, rake leaves and other debris from areas where the unit cannot go, like flower beds etc.

Again, any response from you is appreciated, as usual.
Wouldnt the mower blades on the rider act like your mulcher??

Godslapper
07-10-2012, 06:53 PM
Don't you think that the manufacturers of such units, like the Cub Cadet and other Baggers, would RECOMMEND to their customers to do just that - what you did yourself - thus saving them time and aggravation, especially in communities were they are, by law, forced to bag?

Or, homeowners with similar units like yours, would DO what you did, especially that they own the machine.

There's a reason as to why this is not happening in my humble opinion, and that is, these machine are NOT designed to do that, if they were, people would have done it.

By the way, unless your Cub had a compactor (as an option and it is expensive), you would have had to STOP when the bags are full, and hop off and push somehow the leaves down to pick up more leaves, and have to do that often before you go to the curb and unload.

From the top, our unit is:

1) Non motorized, meaning a lot cheaper than any decent motorized mower, not to mention a ridingmowerwith bagging capability.

2) Very few people buy a riding mower with bagging for the market we're looking for, smaller size lots.

3) The ease of use of our unit, just pushing it like a shopping cart, pull the lever to compact the two bags when needed, keep going until filled, STOP, swiftly pull off the filled bags, put them on the cleared lawn, set up 2 more bags, available on board, and keep going.

4) Before you know it, you'll look behind you and see a bunch of filled bags on the cleared lawn, ready to drag to the curb. And you are done.

I'll also have a small on board rake, to use when I need to say, rake leaves and other debris from areas where the unit cannot go, like flower beds etc.

Again, any response from you is appreciated, as usual.

The cub mulched the leaves just fine. The bags were quite heavy. The thing you've got will do the job, maybe. Why you don't know anyone that has ever put a paper catch bag inside their lawn mower bag is anyones guess. It works quite well. As you said you are going for a very very very small market. Therefor I'm out. Shark tank. lol.

PicknBag
07-10-2012, 10:14 PM
Not here looking for your investment money my man, just throwing the idea out there. I feel very good about the responses I've gotten on here so far, as they've been far more positive than negative. God, you're certainly allowed to use whatever method you want to clear your lawn, so we'll just agree to disagree. Although, I'm just wondering about one thing: what makes you believe the market is so small? Do you have any numbers to back that up at all? After all, there are, like i said, 100,000,000 single detached homes in the country. Let's say only 10% of them fit within our specific demographic (and that's a low estimate), is 10,000,000 a very very very small market? I'm not saying that we're selling 10 million of these suckers, but you are the absolute first person we've spoken to in 3 years who said we're going after a small target market. So you're either the smartest and most insightful guy around, or you're just misinformed. I'm going to trust the research that we've done over your gut instinct.

You don't have to be in love with the idea, but your argument has to have merit, and just because you have a different way of doing it, doesn't in any way make our machine invalid. The majority of posts we got here in just 2 short days have been overwhelmingly positive. Everyone everywhere is yearning for a better way to do this job, that's undeniable. This does it differently than anything else out there - that too, is undeniable. Sure, it looks crude now, and sure, you can rig your machine to do a similar job, but the fact is, no product has ever been marketed to pick up and bag leaves in one step. You're looking at the first one, and we hope to have it on the market in the near future. Thanks again for all your feedback, we do sincerely appreciate it.

CHEESE2009
07-10-2012, 11:06 PM
Putting a paper bag/plastic bag in the mower hardly does anything.

The bags that are made for mowers use breathable material to increase suction and prevent 'tornadoes' lmao. The leaves would just try to escape where they came in from (the chute).

-

Honestly, I think most of you are forgetting that most 'shoppers' are idiots.

Before I get ahead of myself, I must say I like this product so far - but even if it did a lousy job, it would surely sell very well regardless!

NOTHING is worse than hand held leaf vacs, and how many people purchased those? Exactly!

http://www.electriclawncarecenter.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/LH4500-leaf-vacuum-300x300.jpg

I believe this convener belt type system is very intelligent, you could probably get away with hooking up any god damn bag you want to the end of it, and that's awesome!

With tractors even, you take your filled bag only to empty it into another bag = silly (for those who don't have a place to properly dump)...

If you can find a cost-effective way to mulch the leaves, you'll make all the money in the world!

Godslapper
07-11-2012, 07:43 AM
lol. go for it man. what do I know. If I stoped doing something every time someone said that's stupid or that won't work I wouldn't be where I am today.

Wait a minute. On second thought maybe I should have listend to them. WTF ! As far as mower bags needing to be breathable, I agree. Mine had a vent hole in the cover with a screen over it.

At the very least you'll learn a little something about how to do what you're doing. Just try not to let a lawyer get involved. He'll be the only one making any money. Good luck wish you nothing but the best.

PicknBag
07-11-2012, 08:35 AM
Thanks Godslapper, appreciate the kind words. Again, we're not the smartest guys in the room, we were actually extremely surprised when we were granted our patent, because that means that no one else did ever think of it. And that surprised the hell out of us.

Cheese, thanks for articulating your thoughts my friend. I'm not just saying that because you agree with us, I'm saying that because you are pointing out the exact things we've been saying for years (emptying a bag into a bag is pointless, and that lawn vacs are useless because they pick up nothing). My dad has a 200 mile-a-day work route and during the past several years he has spoken to countless people. He'd literally stop his car when he sees someone raking, blowing, or bagging their leaves, and he'd ask them what they'd think if they had his machine as an option. They all said, "why the heck isn't something like that out there already?"

And that's what i wanted to ask you Cheese, why would you say no one has ever thought of this before? It simply can NOT be cost, because like you said, people will buy products that haver no merit, and this one HAS merit, we've determined that. To be honest, cost is the only factor people challenge us with, "oh it'll cost way too much, no one'll buy it." Or, "why would someone buy that for $400 when they've already got a lawnmower that does the same thing?" Only rarely do we get these criticisms, but they're there. And like you pointed out in your post, this machine is nothing like using a lawnmower with a bag attached to it. Because even with that, sure, it's easy to pick up the leaves, but like my dad always says, "what do you do with them then? The leaves are not yet in the brown bag!" The fact that this machine does both, and the leaves are in the standard, universal bag that every town in America accepts in one effortless step is where we feel the true value is. Every other product really only solves half the problem.

So my question Cheese, because you seem like you're a pro, is could there be a reason that we're missing as to why the big companies have yet to produce a product like this?

PicknBag
07-11-2012, 08:37 AM
I'm just going to repost my original post so anyone joining us late can see the video if they're on this 3rd page of comments and didn't get a chance to watch the video, thanks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1StV-6lW64

CHEESE2009
07-11-2012, 09:23 AM
So my question Cheese, because you seem like you're a pro, is could there be a reason that we're missing as to why the big companies have yet to produce a product like this?

Attachments for mowers would seem to sell more because everyone already owns a mower, and that's a huge advantage considering the market is already created.

Not only that, but people are often interested in 'one tool does all' products, because in the end they are probably saving money in the long run.

They have an electric lawn mower created, and it has 3 uses;
Mowing, thatch removal, and aeration - all for about $300. You can see why people would be pushed to buy this over anything else.

-

Your goal should be to make your leaf collector EASY to use, that's why Mac computers are selling so well - people are attracted to simplicity, and are frightened of lots of buttons and levers.




Hope this helps, gotta go to work now LOL... I'm lazy this week.

SECTLANDSCAPING
07-16-2012, 12:15 AM
I liked the idea. I just never used a sweeper that worked good. The problem wasnt the bagging it was the sweeper sucked. Even the vacuums dont pick up good unless there big 18 hp engines.

CHEESE2009
07-16-2012, 12:22 AM
I wish I could carry around a bucket of lava... Throw everything into it, and it's gone!

Dog in the backyard when I want to mow? It's gone!

PicknBag
07-16-2012, 08:10 AM
Hey Select,

The sweeper's pick-up capability would be of absolute importance. We too have used crappy ones where it was pointless to even use. This machine, from top to bottom, would have to be constructed with utmost care with engineering being top of mind. We are very sure that it can perform as we intend it to, and have various ways to ensure that every single leaf will be picked up.

One of the main problems when going over your lawn with a sweeper are the little "undulations" that every lawn has. That is, the lawn isn't exactly 100% flat, and fallen leaves always find their way into these little sunken parts of the lawn. We do believe that we have a way to make sure these leaves are also picked up.

The idea here is this machine has to be 100% functional, or else it won't be any different than any of the other products out there that only do 1/2 the job. We want it to work so well that when your neighbor sees it in action, he will inquire about where you got it.

Godslapper
07-16-2012, 08:24 AM
Will it work on steep hills or does the lawn need to be flat. What about wet leaves ?

xandrew245x
07-16-2012, 11:19 AM
I didn't read through all the other posts on this topic so I don't know if anyone already covered it. This is basically a lawn sweeper that bags them for you. If you could make it a tow behind that would sweep up the leaves, mulch them and then transport them into bags with the same conveyer belt style that you have, that would be a golden machine, if it would pick up 99% of the leaves.

PicknBag
07-16-2012, 03:50 PM
Andrew, thanks for the comment. You're 100% right, all this really is is a lawn sweeper that automatically bags the leaves for you. However simple it may seem, we're hoping the public views the added bonus as a necessity.

When you use a standard lawn sweeper, the main draw is the minimal effort required to pick up the leaves. But once the hopper is full, that's when the difficulty begins. When we had a sweeper at home, it would take one or two passes on our 30-40ft lot and the whole damn thing was full. We'd then have to disengage the hopper, and then try to funnel those leaves into the brown paper bags - it just didn't happen. That's when we came up with this idea. We loved using a lawn sweeper, but hated the fact that it only solved half the problem.

To your question about a tow-behind, yes, we'd ideally like to implement that in the future, and I understand that we are on a commercial landscapers website. But for now, we're focusing on the push-powered segment of the market. We will certainly be looking to license our patented technique to any companies that are interested in using it more in the commercial realm down the road.

Thanks so much for commenting, if you have anything that you'd think would improve the machine we'd love to hear it. Once produced, it will have a mulcher and a compactor, so as to maximize every square inch of the leaf bags.

And Godslapper, yes, we do have many ideas in mind for dislodging wet leaves, and also for dealing with angled landscape. Thanks for asking that question, because they are both valid ones.

PicknBag
07-19-2012, 10:06 PM
Hey guys thanks again for all the feedback so far. I'm looking to see if anyone knows of any similar forums (lawn and garden, DIY, homeowners, tools, etc) where I can ask people's opinion like I did here? Would love to be able to reach additional people for their input. Thanks.

Godslapper
07-20-2012, 08:12 AM
When can I get one and how can I get one ? How much will it cost ? I can't wait to add this to my business. I think with one of these I should be able to dubble my business and my productivity. Thanks It's guys like you that make life easyer. Keep up the good work.

willshome
07-27-2012, 09:07 PM
Does anyone remember the thread about a guy inventing a leaf collector that would mulch and bag it for you, I can't seem to find his thread. I wanted to share this with him.

http://www.mnn.com/your-home/at-home/blogs/leafy-and-green
here you go

xandrew245x
07-27-2012, 09:10 PM
Thanks will, couldn't seem to find it.

I stumbled across that while surfing the net, its similar to what you have in mind, but different, think it could give you a couple ideas.

brian'slawncare
07-27-2012, 09:45 PM
Great idea! keep up the good work, soon you'll be rolling in the cash.....hopefully

I know others have said it, but mulching, self propelled, and a towing feature would make this perfect!

Maybe just make a spinning blade like wood chippers?? :confused:

Also, I love this idea!

Maybe you should just make custom bags to fit any size mower bag. That would help.

just make breathable bag inserts to put inside the bagger of the mower. THis way, you just remove and replace the bag. Kind of similar to what you do with a garbage can. The can being the existing bagger and the trash bag being the breathable inserts...

Again, love the idea! and what you said in one of the first few posts about patent examiners being really busy, is sooo true. My dad is a US Patent examiner and they have enough work to keep them busy for years to come. So congrats that you were lucky enough to get a patent. Good luck. :D

SECTLANDSCAPING
07-27-2012, 10:00 PM
http://www.mnn.com/sites/default/files/user-36/PowerRake.jpg

That thing looks nice. It looks like the only difference is this one folds and picknbag has the disposable bags.